rogerowen Posted July 17, 2019 Report Share Posted July 17, 2019 Thought this might be an easy exercise in the restoration of my TR4A - replace brake drums with new ones. Ha, Ha - they don't fit! Wheel stud holes in new drums are too small to go over the wheel stud lower flanges. Old drums hole diameter = 14.6mm, new drums hole diameter..........13mm. I realise that 'fettling' is all part of the fun, ordering a 14.5mm drill bit as I write. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ianc Posted July 17, 2019 Report Share Posted July 17, 2019 Please tell us the source of your new drums. Have you informed the vendor? Ian Cornish Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Z320 Posted July 17, 2019 Report Share Posted July 17, 2019 On my IRS this studs are 1/2" (12.7 mm) with thread 7/16 and the drums would fit. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
rogerowen Posted July 17, 2019 Author Report Share Posted July 17, 2019 18 minutes ago, ianc said: Please tell us the source of your new drums. Have you informed the vendor? Ian Cornish Haven't told Rimmer about this issue yet - but in the past I have flagged up several problems to them and their stock reply is always 'We have not received any other complaints - sold loads of these' without any problems' . I now feel that there is no point in contacting them. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Z320 Posted July 17, 2019 Report Share Posted July 17, 2019 no problem with new rimmer drums on my TR4A IRS Quote Link to post Share on other sites
rogerowen Posted July 17, 2019 Author Report Share Posted July 17, 2019 5 minutes ago, Z320 said: On my IRS this studs are 1/2" (12.7 mm) with thread 7/16 and the drums would fit. Do your wheel studs have the same flange at the hub end? Haben Ihre Radbolzen am Nabenende den gleichen Flansch? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RogerH Posted July 17, 2019 Report Share Posted July 17, 2019 Hi Roger, you say you have a TR4A but those studs are for a TR4. The 4A stud is pushed in from inboard to outboard thought he hub flange. The TR4 stud is screwed in from outboard to inboard. The should should not be there. Roger Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Z320 Posted July 17, 2019 Report Share Posted July 17, 2019 6 minutes ago, rogerowen said: Do your wheel studs have the same flange at the hub end? Haben Ihre Radbolzen am Nabenende den gleichen Flansch? Yes but smaller, 1/2" stud reduced to 7/16" thread. Pushed through from behind. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
rogerowen Posted July 17, 2019 Author Report Share Posted July 17, 2019 Aha, that could be because my car is a 4A - Solid Axle! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
rogerowen Posted July 17, 2019 Author Report Share Posted July 17, 2019 2 minutes ago, Z320 said: Yes but smaller, 1/2" stud reduced to 7/16" thread. Pushed through from behind. Ah, obviously a difference between IRS and Solid Axle. Thank you very much for your input. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Tr4aJim Posted July 17, 2019 Report Share Posted July 17, 2019 My solid axle 4a has threaded studs in the rear (attached from outside to inside). The fronts are pressed in (attached from inside to outside). Jim Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Drewmotty Posted July 17, 2019 Report Share Posted July 17, 2019 Looks like you have a solid axle 4a there with the same hubs as a 3A/4 You needed the drums for the earlier cars for a fit out of the box. Did you let the supplier know that your 4A was solid axle? I guess that drilling out the holes will be fine as long as that’s the only difference which can spot. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Tr4aJim Posted July 17, 2019 Report Share Posted July 17, 2019 According to the Stanpart catalogue for the live axle Tr4a, the rear wheel stud part numbers are 100869 (steel wheel) and 110365 (wire wheel). Also the Revington TR site says the following regarding part 100869: This wheel stud which screws into the hub is used at the front of TR2-3 Drum brake cars fitted with steel wheels and at the rear of all TR2-4 (and TR4A fitted with a rigid axle) fitted with steel wheels. It is not uncommon for these studs to pull out of the hub, if this happens Revington TR are at the rescue with a repair procedure. Order part number RTR1385 or RTR1385+10 and oversize tap RTR1379. Full list of original applications: - Front; TR2-3 Drum brake cars Front; wire wheels. No studs; spline integral with the hub TR2-3 Drum brake cars Front; steel wheels. 100869 TR3 (Disc brake cars)-6 Front; wire wheels. 114281 TR3 (Disc brake cars)-6 Front; steel wheels. 114282 Rear; TR2-3 Lockheed axle; wire wheels. No studs; spline integral with the hub TR3 (Girling axle)-4 and TR4A rigid axle Rear; wire wheels. 110365 TR2-4 and TR4A rigid axle Rear; steel wheels. 100869 TR4A-6 independent suspension; wire wheels. 142799 TR4A-6 independent suspension; steel wheels. 132317 Please note that short studs intended for wire wheel applications should NEVER be used with steel wheels or aftermarket alloy wheels. ALWAYS use the longer studs. The steel wheel attachment nut is 109586 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ianc Posted July 18, 2019 Report Share Posted July 18, 2019 I believe that Stuart has a 4A with solid axle, so perhaps he can advise on this - as we know, he has great knowledge of all models. Ian Cornish Quote Link to post Share on other sites
rogerowen Posted July 18, 2019 Author Report Share Posted July 18, 2019 Thanks for the comments so far. Rimmer are aware of the issue - their drums will not fit any car with a Girling axle. There's a video on you tube. I don't think anyone supplies new drums that will fit, and drilling might be the only option. As per this video a 9/16th reamer is required (cheapest I've found at Zoro is £40), author of the video does not recommend drilling. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
rogerowen Posted July 18, 2019 Author Report Share Posted July 18, 2019 (edited) I wonder how many Girling axled cars are out there with the drums not properly fitted. Edited July 18, 2019 by rogerowen Spelling mistake Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Z320 Posted July 18, 2019 Report Share Posted July 18, 2019 (edited) I think we TR owners are very lucky to get new spare parts for nice price, so for me it is OK to make some modifications. I would take a drill (run the drilling machine slower) and with the drum fixed on the drill machine the drill will be round enough. And you might realise the position of the drum is not due to the 4 drills but to the 2 small and tiny screws. Ciao, Marco Edited July 18, 2019 by Z320 My bad english Quote Link to post Share on other sites
stuart Posted July 18, 2019 Report Share Posted July 18, 2019 I have a solid axle 4a and it did have those shouldered studs as per the earlier cars, I was lucky when I restored it that my original drums were fine, However now I have changed to 10" Alfins and Alloys I deleted those studs and drilled the hubs to take the same type of studs as fitted to the front but in a slightly longer version from Cambridge Automotive. There is a note in the Moss catalogue to the effect of having to drill 9" drums to fit Girling axle cars. Stuart. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
rogerowen Posted July 18, 2019 Author Report Share Posted July 18, 2019 Ordered a drill bit (£6), but after watching the video decided to go for a machine reamer (£40). I wonder if I was a dedicated parts supplier if I might just take a handful of drums, ream them out, attach a new part number and offer them up as the correct fit for Girling axled cars - but then, thankfully I'm not a dedicated parts supplier. Anyone want to borrow the reamer when I've finished with it - you will be very welcome. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Z320 Posted July 18, 2019 Report Share Posted July 18, 2019 A special edition makes the price double, not possible to get this on TR owners Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RogerH Posted July 18, 2019 Report Share Posted July 18, 2019 10 minutes ago, rogerowen said: Ordered a drill bit (£6), but after watching the video decided to go for a machine reamer (£40). I wonder if I was a dedicated parts supplier if I might just take a handful of drums, ream them out, attach a new part number and offer them up as the correct fit for Girling axled cars - but then, thankfully I'm not a dedicated parts supplier. Anyone want to borrow the reamer when I've finished with it - you will be very welcome. Hi Roger, There is a company in Devon - Tracy Tools - that do all these drilling / cutting tools. Expanding reamer £10 - also good quality https://www.tracytools.com/straight-taper-reamers Roger Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RobH Posted July 18, 2019 Report Share Posted July 18, 2019 (edited) You're paying a lot for that reamer. If you buy a hand-reamer like this you'll have a lot of change though there's a bit more effort involved : https://www.rdgtools.co.uk/acatalog/ADJUSTABLE-REAMER--RANGE-17-32----19-32------MEDIUM-SET--H5-8293.html Edited July 18, 2019 by RobH Quote Link to post Share on other sites
rogerowen Posted July 18, 2019 Author Report Share Posted July 18, 2019 3 minutes ago, Z320 said: A special edition makes the price double, not possible to get this on TR owners True! I'm still quids in - the car only cost me £1500 (scrapper). Quote Link to post Share on other sites
rogerowen Posted July 18, 2019 Author Report Share Posted July 18, 2019 1 minute ago, RogerH said: Hi Roger, There is a company in Devon - Tracy Tools - that do all these drilling / cutting tools. Expanding reamer £10 - also good quality https://www.tracytools.com/straight-taper-reamers Roger Thanks, I'll keep them in mind for future. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
rogerowen Posted July 18, 2019 Author Report Share Posted July 18, 2019 4 minutes ago, RobH said: You're paying a lot for that reamer. If you buy a hand-reamer like this you'll have a lot of change though there's a bit more effort involved: https://www.rdgtools.co.uk/acatalog/7-16--HAND-REAMER--HIGH-SPEED--704855.html Spent ages Googling - that was cheapest I could find......Oh well. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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