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Tools, how can they do it for the money?


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This little die grinder is a great tool but how can they do it for the money even coming all the way from China which is where I presume it was made.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/US-PRO-Tools-1-4-Collet-Straight-Air-Die-Grinder-Grinding-Tool-NEW-8421/252243918220?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2060353.m1438.l2649

Stuart.

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Baffles me Stuart!

i suspect we in the west have lost sight of the value of things, the £3 Latte is to blame !

steve

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It's the shipping that amazes me. Why it is cheaper for companies making machines out of cast iron, then ship them half-way round the world... Also some small items get delivered for less than what a stamp would cast here.

Manufacturing costs are, by western standards, crazily low in China because the cost of living is so low, held down by government control of the exchange rates.

Pete

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back in 2015 a UK model railway manufacturer quoted some thing like £8.50/hour labour rate to assembly his models

In china it was £1.50.   I imagine that has gone up slightly.

 

However I understand that the Chinese Gov't foot the postage.

So you order a £5 item. It arrives within a week - so it didn;t come by rickshaw.

 

That sounds like fair competition.  But then we are used to that after the 1960's Japanese motorbike invasion.

 

Roger

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I bought a Bosch fuel pump bracket, the extruded aluminium type, black anodized for 4,52 euro, including shipping. Same bracket would cost 40 euro/30 pound here, but without shipping. Not everythibk from China is bad, and I’m convinced many of the special parts we buy are manufactured there.

you can also buy a Bosch replica pump for under 20 euro, I left that for others;)

Waldi

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Back in 2017 we had a 3 week holiday in China and pulled in 3 days in Hong Kong, included in the tour we naturally had a journey from the airport on the Shanghai Mag lev train, the airport is 30km away...it takes 8 minutes the train speeds reach 431 km/hr !

Our guide proudly pointed out the in carriage digital speedometer which read out at the 431 figure, he said "wait until it comes down to 350km/hr, the speed is reduced to that because there's another Mag lev train coming the other way on the tracks alongside, the speed of both trains is reduced because displacing the air in front at these speeds is enough to knock another close running  train off tracks...guess how we found that out !"

America has a problem, the time to worry about the Chinese and their capabilities was about 15 years ago, and then take commercial and industrial steps to ameliorate (reduce) the effects, they didn't, America has a problem. Their industrial base will be gutted and their factories and industries reduced to bit players in the world commercial markets.

The Chinese have a great advantage, they are a dextrous people, see this more traditional illustration of a Tiger below, it's not a photo or even painted artwork...it's silk embroidery , without knots, covering a panel 1 metre high and taking 15 months to make. The AI revolution which will damage western society will only have marginal effects upon them, they already have a workforce which will turn up day in and day out and perform tasks repetitively and minutely accurately, and do it at hourly rates western companies can only dream about. 

When Britain was the "workshop of the world" we only had one standard, the best we could do. For many years that was enough but in todays market where competition demands the best price and at a standard which is commensurate with the job the Chinese have the upper hand. They can turn out work and components to whatever quality you want, it's just if you want better, you pay more. Many of our western  retailing firms are just using the Chinese manufacture to rack up profits, and letting their own customers cycle through the poorly made components turned out. See the similarity with Ford Cortina MK3 (then the best selling fleet car) camshafts from the 1970s where dozens of cars would come past you on roads rattling like castanets' ? If you took your car back to the dealership the parts department would wearily reach behind it to the parts bin stuffed with the camshafts and the dealership would  carry out warranty work which lasted maybe another 12 months before again the camshaft reverted to round. Nothing is new in business.  

Since Xi Jinping came to power in China in 2012 he has achieved something miraculous, a single party Communist system which under Mao caused multiple famines has since under his leadership morphed into a single party system which has a Capitalist face. It takes advantage of the wests failures of worker discipline and "excessive" democracy ( Brexit anybody ?) where no matter which side you voted by using the system against itself actual progress can be stopped.

We visited the Three Gorges dam project whilst we were in China, the worlds largest hydro electric project with numbers involved in almost every dimension so large they cannot be compared with anything western. The vast surface area covered by the Yangzi since the building of the dam has displaced many communities...1.3 million..1.3 million ! can you imagine the "consultation " that was carried out with their affected population ?..."So that's what we going to do, the footings are being poured next month...pack your belongings" ! No wonder western democracies cannot compete with them.

So the only reason Chinese made products do not perform is because the wholesaler and retailers in our countries do not invest more in their manufacture preferring to take the profit.

I have seen the future...it is Chinese.

Mick Richards   

 

IMG_0329.JPG

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48 minutes ago, stillp said:

I haven't been there since the mid-eighties Mick. Do they still have the dual currency system of renminbi and FEC?

Pete

Hi Pete,

We didn't come up against anything other than Renminbi mostly called Yuan, did you mean FEN when you quoted FEC ? here's an up to date currency review on it.

Chinese Money

The official currency in China is the Renminbi (RMB or CNY) or in Chinese "Ren-min-bi". The basic unit is the yuan (also known as "kuai"), which equals 10 jiao (or "mao"), which is then divided into 10 fen. Paper currency comes in 1.2,5,10,50 and 100 yuan notes. Paper jiao come in denominations of 1, 2, and 5. There are also 1 and 2 fen notes, but these are rarely used as they have no purchasing power. 1 yuan, 1 and 5 jiao, and 1, 2, and 5 fen coins are even common used in larger cities.

You can get Yuan changed in Hong Kong, but no chance with their HK Dollars in China.

Mick Richards

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Mick, when I was there, and at least well into the 90s, the yuan existed in two versions: the RMB, which means "Peoples' Money" which was for Chinese nationals only, and FEC (Foreign Exchange Certificate) which was for foreigners. It was illegal for Chinese nationals to have FEC without a licence issued by the local Customs officer, and also for foreigners to have RMB. The penalties for transgressing these rules were apparently severe for nationals - I was (and presumably still am) banned from further visits to China for possessing a large amount of RMB, having sold the contents of my exhibition stand to a university in Wuhan. Only FEC could be exchanged for 'hard' currencies.

Now, what results from that is that only people with FEC can buy goods from outside China, so they have a higher effective value than the same nominal amount of yuan in RMB. Exporters who bring in hard currency are very highly respected, and can make a great deal of profit by exchanging FEC into RMB.  In the 80s the exchange rate varied between about 12 to 15 RMB yuan to each FEC yuan. So, if there are let's say 5 yuan to the dollar, a Chinese factory exports goods to the value of $100, he receives 500FEC, which he can (subject to the correct licences etc) spend on imports, or change those FEC for something over 6000RMB, which has a notional value equivalent of over $1200.

On a guided tour you'll only see what you're allowed to, but the last time I had contact with Europeans working in China the same system existed.

Pete

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Under $10 from my local Harbor Freight

https://www.harborfreight.com/air-tools/grinders/1-4-quarter-inch-45-cfm-air-die-grinder-92144.html

These tools are mostly fine for occasional use. I think of them as consumables. I doubt they would hold up in a production shop but I am occasionally surprised.

I have yet to figure out how I can buy something from China and have it delivered to the USA for a total cost of $1.50

Stan

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And this looks like it’s a different badged Clarke impact wrench/gun at a good price for occasional use. 

Blackline 450Nm Mains Impact Wrench 1/2" Drive SWE200 https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.ebay.co.uk%2Fulk%2Fitm%2F331594881295

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The ridiculously low shipping rates from China are at least partly due to an antiquated international postal agreement dating from the 19th century.  The agreement, sort of like a treaty, is today administered by the UN through the Universal Postal Union (UPU).  Google it for more details.

Ed

 

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