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pjtr8

Dunlop M-Type wheel and TR4A "World" hubcaps

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Hello All,

I think have read every post relating to wire wheels and genuine minilites. Although I haven't seen this topic brought up and I am keen to hear people's thoughts.

Currently I have 72 spoke 5.5 inch wires on my TR4A although the wheels are in great shape, I am not a huge fan of wires. I am tempted by genuine minilites, however discussion regarding Dunlop's M-Type wheel has stirred my interest enough to raise this topic and seek other members opinions.

The thing is that I have always loved the "world" badge that comes with the TR4A and as the steel wheels with hubcaps has this emblem on it they would be my preferred choice over wires or minilites.

However the issue is that the steels only come in 4.5 inches width (I am fairly surr you can't get 5.5 inch steel wheels and fit these hubcaps?) and my understanding is that the strength and quality of these steel wheels is questionable, particularly when compared to something like a genuine minilites.

 

So here are my questions...

If money was not a consideration, could someone buy Dunlop M-Type Wheels and have the "world" hub caps retro fitted to them?

And even if this was possible would they be  considered crazy for modifying a wonderful set of alloys?

I am really keen to hear people's thoughts on this.

Regards.

Paul

IMG_20180715_124341.jpg

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The wheel you seek is the original 5.5" x 15 1969 only TR6 steel rim which has the 3 prongs to fit the Rostyle dustbin lid wheel trim to.  The prongs are correctly spaced but too long for hub caps making the cap stand an inch or so from the rim face.  These prongs can be removed, turned down to a shorter length in a lathe and refitted.

I know of 3 TR's fitted with these wheels including my TR3, they have been fitted since 1975, when the '69 TR6 steel wheels were under £10.00 each new.

Peter W

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Thanks Peter,

That sounds like a plan. I will start the hunt for 1969 TR6 steel rims. I doubt that they come up very often?

Thanks again,

Regards Paul

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I’ve seen the later TR6 wheels fitted with studs for early hubcaps although as the wheels lack the flats for the studs they need to be angled to suit or fitted at an angle. 

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Paul

Could you not take the globe badges off the hubcaps and fit them to the centre caps of some alloy wheels? You could probably fit them to the centre of an eared knock on for wire wheels but I'm not sure how good that would look!!

Cheers

Rich

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Thanks for your replies. I thought the later TR6 wheels are 6 inch, and I'd like the width to remain 5.5 inch. As for the fixing the emblem to the knock on centres, although I have seen it done and think it looks good, it is just too far from the original hub cap look for me.

I am also considering having some 4.5inch wheels banded if anyone knows of any original TR4A wheels and hubcaps for sale?

Thanks again for your input.

Regards,

Paul.

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I had some banded wheels once that came with a TR2, Bit "Carlos Fandango" though! :lol::lol::lol:

Stuart.

 

TR2 001.jpg

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16 hours ago, pjtr8 said:

Thanks for your replies. I thought the later TR6 wheels are 6 inch, and I'd like the width to remain 5.5 inch. As for the fixing the emblem to the knock on centres, although I have seen it done and think it looks good, it is just too far from the original hub cap look for me.

I am also considering having some 4.5inch wheels banded if anyone knows of any original TR4A wheels and hubcaps for sale?

Thanks again for your input.

Regards,

Paul.

TR6 wheel size was 5.5 width throughout the production.

Have you spoken with Weller?

https://www.wellerwheels.com/wheels/classics/

Peter W

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Paul

Do you mean like this?

IMG_2751.thumb.JPG.561c5cc6208930b2f338d5eac3bce5b1.JPG

These are TR6 wheels on my 4.

It might not be clear, but the little pins to hold the hubcap have an extender - Revington supplied the wheels.

Regards
David

 

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I was thinking about the same lines - TR6 wheels with hubcaps on my 2000 Mk1.

But not so sure now seeing the picture of the wheel. Seems the hubcap is a distance from the wheel? I would prefer to have it against the wheel. 

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Hello All,
I have spent too much time on this the last couple of days, but learnt a lot. Thanks for your help.
 
There are three options to create the original TR4A steel rims and hubcap look in 5.5 inch instead of the 4.5 as they left the factory.
 
1. Find a set of very rare 1969 TR6 wheels (the ones designed for Rostyle hupcaps). Although because the pips (that hold the hubcaps in place) are quite a bit longer, you would need to alter them so the cap sits closer to the wheel (as per the image above from David). This is the easiest option if of course you get your hands on any.
 
2. You could buy 4.5 inch original wheels in decent shape with the correct size pips, have them banded by 1 inch and then re powder coated. If using wheel beautifiers, they would need to be an inch deeper. This is an easy option if you don't mind coordinating the various stages, and cost is fairly high if buying the wheels, new hubcaps, deeper beautifiers and paying for banding, powder coating and shipping (approx £1000 for set of 5). I also checked with insurance and they said there would be no issues.
 
3. I have contacted Weller Wheels who make 5.5 inch TR6 rims (with 15 holes instead of 12) to see if they can manufacture them with the pips to hold the original TR4A hubcaps. Which may in fact be the cheapest option although I am still waiting to hear if it is possible.
 
I also used PowerPoint to show the various options. I told you have spent too long on this. See 4 pictures, with 72 spoke wires, original "World" hubcaps, minilites, and Dunlop M-Types. I am interested to hear which one's others prefer? For me it is the original hubcaps or Dunlop's.
 
Thanks again for all your help.
 
Regards,
Paul

Wire wheels.JPG

World hubcap wheels.JPG

Minilite wheels.JPG

Dunlop M-Type wheel.JPG

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1 hour ago, badhuis said:

I was thinking about the same lines - TR6 wheels with hubcaps on my 2000 Mk1.

But not so sure now seeing the picture of the wheel. Seems the hubcap is a distance from the wheel? I would prefer to have it against the wheel. 

Winter months I used Stag 14"  steel wheels on an Innsbruck 2000/2500 Mk II instead of the Stag alloys, that were specified for the 2500S.  The UK 2.5 PI police spec hubcap that used that 14" steel wheel was from an Herald, and does not have a world badge.  TR hubcaps are wrong diameter for the Stag wheels.

The TR 6 rim offset causes a regular tyre to rub the arch at the rear from memory.

Peter W

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Quote

Stag 14"  steel wheels

Quote

14" steel wheel was from an Herald

14" steel wheels would not be my first choice for a Saloon wheel as the tyres get more difficult to buy (and are getting more expensive). There is so much more choice for 15" wheels. There are some pictures of Mk1 Saloons wearing TR6 wheels and I always wonder if the Mk1 hubcap could be made to fit a TR6 wheel. 

 

As for the TR4/TR4a: my preference go to the standard steel wheel with hubcap (same as on my TR4). Whatever you choose please do not fit the minilites. These seem to be on more than half of all restored TR s, plus on all MGs, Spitfires, Minis etcetera etcetera. They are just too much around.

  

 

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Yes I agree, minilites are my least favourite. The last question I need answered is...

Can anyone with original steel wheels (4.5 inch) confirm how much distance there is from the out edge of the wheel to the outer edge of the wheel arch?

As if I am going to add 1 inch via wheel banding then the outer edge of the wheel will extend 1 inch further and therefore I need to be sure it doesn't protrude the body work.

I am looking at pictures online to confirm this before buying a set of 4.5 inch wheels, which is risky. I'd rather find someone who could confirm the distance between the two first.

Thanks again!

Paul

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I wanted to update this thread with an outcome.

I got my TR4A back this weekend. I had the hard top finished (see pic below). I also found some early TR6 wheels, had pips from standard TR wheels welded on and job done.

I know it is all personal taste, and probably not for everyone but it allows me to keep the 5.5j width and still have the hub caps with Triumph Globe badge which I love.

I also found a Globe badge that fits the Moto-Lita steering wheel perfectly (see pic below).

Happy to share what I learnt from this process if anyone wants to get in touch.

 

2018-12-09_07-57-49.jpg

2018-12-09_07-58-24.jpg

2018-12-08_11-13-33.jpg

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Hello Paul

I have a set of the early TR6 5.5 inch rostyle hubs with shorter prongs fitted so was very interested to see your final result. Haven't got around to getting them powder coated yet though. I was also considering fitting the stainless wheel trims that were not fitted to the 4A. I have standard 5.5 inch TR6 wheels at present on the 4A with the stainless trims. Only concern I have with hubcaps is that they are easily removed by thieves and can fall off if you hit a pothole. Just wondering if anyone has invented a cunning anti theft device for hub caps (other than wiring them up to the mains).

Also where did you find the centre for the steering wheel?

Keith

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Yes, unfortunately I don't have a solution for the hubcaps. Although I like your suggested solution best!

As for the steering wheel badge. It is from the popular key rings sold on eBay. Just cut and file and they are a perfect fit. No need to even use double sided tape. I couldn't believe it!

BTW, I painted rather than powder coated the wheels. Particularly as I was using rim embellishers and hubcaps.

All the best.

Paul

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Hello Paul

Maybe silly question but I was thinking of getting wheels powder coated and using the steel embellishers as well. Did you decide to paint so you could touch up scratches or is paint better? Also my (TR6) wheels are silver grey at present. Don't know what the colour code is though.

I like your steering wheel centre.

Keith

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Hi Paul, I like the M types, are they centre lock like the wires, and do they come in 4.5 and 5.5 width.

Chris

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18 hours ago, keith1948 said:

Hello Paul

Maybe silly question but I was thinking of getting wheels powder coated and using the steel embellishers as well. Did you decide to paint so you could touch up scratches or is paint better? Also my (TR6) wheels are silver grey at present. Don't know what the colour code is though.

I like your steering wheel centre.

Keith

Hi Keith,

Yes I used paint as it was easier to redo when needed in the future.

As for silver paint code, I used the one below as it is lighter than the original BMC grey finish that some people use and I felt looks nicer.

Paint code is...
Color: Silver, Argent.   Model years: 73-81.   Primary Color Code: MCB.    Alternate Color Code: 396.    PPG/Ditzler Color Code: 33504

2018-12-29_12-05-40.jpg

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16 hours ago, ChrisR-4A said:

Hi Paul, I like the M types, are they centre lock like the wires, and do they come in 4.5 and 5.5 width.

Chris

Hi Chris,

Yes they are centre lock although I am not sure if they come in 4.5, I was recommended to speak to Ed at Frontline Developments ed@frontlinedevelopments.com

Worth getting in touch with them if interested.

Regards Paul

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Thanks Paul for info. Can't imagine my car ever looking as spotless as yours. Your wheels look really good. I did toy with the idea of doing the wheel colour same as the body as on early TR's but decided against it.

Keith

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On 2/18/2019 at 10:01 PM, Britishbest said:

Hi Paul

Did Weller wheels come back to you about fitting the hub cap pips to TR6 wheels?    I'd like to go the same route.

Thanks

Colt

Hi Colt,

Sorry for my slow reply.

They did say the could do them but was likely to be a 9-12 month wait.

Good luck with it if you do go down that route.

Regards,

Paul.

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