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Diff whine.....AGAIN!


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#1 simonjrwinter

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Posted 04 June 2018 - 08:05 PM

Here we go again.
Less than a year after installing my reconditioned diff, its started whing again.
I was supplied a reconditioned Diff last year after a 10 month wait and an £800 bill by a self-proclaimed expert with promises of a silent leak-free diff. To be fair, the diff wept as soon as I installed it and there was a small whine from day one but its getting worse and Ive only done about 200 miles. Despite promises of a guarantee on the diff, theres no way Im sending it back to France (or wherever the hell this bodge artist is living now) so Ive got to sort it myself. Has anyone any experience of these oil additives that are supposed to quieten diffs or gearboxes?
Simon
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...the oil stain under my TR is bigger than yours, so there!
 

 


#2 PodOne

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Posted 04 June 2018 - 08:58 PM

Hi Simon

 

Sorry to hear your diff is whinning after £800 and 200 hundred miles I think I would be a bit more than peed off. Trying to reduce the noise with additive is simply masking the issue that the diff hasn't being sorted out in the first place and there is still a mechanical issue to resolve. May well have been filled last time round thick oil and even the old trick of using saw dust to give the impression of a repair given the whine was still there to a degree from the off.

 

I'd wait to see if someone can recommend a decent UK repairer near you or point you towards a good secondhand unit.

 

Best of luck

 

Andy.


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#3 simonjrwinter

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Posted 04 June 2018 - 09:16 PM

To be honest, Im happy to mask it if itll last me another year or so. Just as long as I dont have to take the bloody thing out again!

Edited by simonjrwinter, 04 June 2018 - 09:16 PM.

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...the oil stain under my TR is bigger than yours, so there!
 

 


#4 Mike C

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Posted 04 June 2018 - 09:47 PM

When I was a lot younger dodgy dealers would use steam engine oil to quieten a noisy diff , but for long term  it does not have the  EP properties needed for sliding gear surfaces, such as in a diff.

 

Maybe an industrial EP gear  oil will be worth a look, such as these:

 

https://www.google.c...9DJySRR-Veky_8t


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#5 TriumphV8

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Posted 05 June 2018 - 06:24 AM

Unfortunately you did not say if GT was the expert.

If so I would expect that he did not have the tools

to give the diff the preload in the two required places.

 

The V8 applies much more power to the diff so it must be sure

that crown wheel and pinon keep exactely in the proper position

under this heavy load. That is the job of the preoad!

 

Sorry to say but applying power to a diff without the correct preload

and without a proper setting starts a somewhat grinding at CWP.

The reason is simply that both mating surfaces do not match and instead

a load spread of a larger surface you have a havy load on a line just

similar to makin a scratch with a sharp edge of a screwdriver.

 

Keep in mind that all in the drivetrain of the TR6 is at the limit

if you go for V8 power.

What a carb TR6 will tolerate for some years will ruin a V8 within miles.

It must be made from superior quality!

 

My recommendation is not to reuse the CWP although it was expensive.

What about asking Mike Papworth for help?


Edited by TriumphV8, 05 June 2018 - 06:27 AM.

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Cheers

Andreas


#6 simonjrwinter

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Posted 05 June 2018 - 06:42 AM

Andreas,
The V8 in my car is nowhere near a powerful as yours. In fact I’d be surprised if it was significantly more powerful than the standard engine. Added to that, I don’t think I’ve driven it hard once since the Diff was installed (I mostly drive with my wife in the car with me!)
The whine is nowhere near as bad as the original “rebuilt” Diff but it’s worse than it was when I installed it and Ideally Id like to stop it getting any worse (ignore my previous comment about quietening it rather than fixing it, I was a bit pee’d off with it)
I’ll try and find a local specialist I can take it to.
Simon
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...the oil stain under my TR is bigger than yours, so there!
 

 


#7 Kevo_6

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Posted 05 June 2018 - 07:01 AM

Andreas,
The V8 in my car is nowhere near a powerful as yours. In fact I’d be surprised if it was significantly more powerful than the standard engine. Added to that, I don’t think I’ve driven it hard once since the Diff was installed (I mostly drive with my wife in the car with me!)
The whine is nowhere near as bad as the original “rebuilt” Diff but it’s worse than it was when I installed it and Ideally Id like to stop it getting any worse (ignore my previous comment about quietening it rather than fixing it, I was a bit pee’d off with it)
I’ll try and find a local specialist I can take it to.
Simon

I used Hardy Engineering Ltd in Leatherhead, I would highly recommend them. Give Bill a ring and talk it over with him.
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Cheers Kev.


#8 astontr6

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Posted 05 June 2018 - 07:09 AM

I used Hardy Engineering Ltd in Leatherhead, I would highly recommend them. Give Bill a ring and talk it over with him.

+1 for Hardy engineering.

 

Bruce


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#9 TriumphV8

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Posted 05 June 2018 - 07:32 AM

Andreas,
The V8 in my car is nowhere near a powerful as yours.
I’ll try and find a local specialist I can take it to.
Simon

 

It is the torque that kills the diff and we have a lot more than the original.

Just the one litre more displacement plays a heavy role.

In the 80 I was running the 3.5 with a crane sports cam.

Just with that I had to change the universal joints of the drive shafts every year.

I loved to accelerate in 2nd where the TR6 lays down on the bump stops

and what a normal TR6 does for a moment in 1st a V8 does for many

seconds even in 3rd. Only a perfect diff and fresh mounting areas at the frame

can handle that power without doing some harm.

 

The hints with local specialists will help. Although I also do not

have a fully quiet diff what I prepared by myself

my CWP is the same for many, many years

and with top down there is no noise to be noticed.

So a specialist definitely will prepare a diff that lasts.


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Cheers

Andreas


#10 RogerH

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Posted 08 June 2018 - 06:33 PM

Hi Simon,

                 oil or additives will not help you.

If you want to get rid of the whine then drop the diff and take it to Hardy engineering In Leatherhead as suggested above.

 

My diff was not quite whining but a serious hum and leaked like a sieve.

When I reinstalled it after Hardy's had weaved their magic it was  a totally different lump.

All new seals, bearings and cuddles.

£520 inc vat.

 

No humming and no leaking and it feels great.

 

Roger


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#11 Nigel A

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Posted 08 June 2018 - 06:38 PM

Crown Classics recently did mine and it is perfect

Cheers

Nigel
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#12 simonjrwinter

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Posted 08 June 2018 - 06:59 PM

Thanks gents. After already laying out £800+ I’m seeing what my options are....
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...the oil stain under my TR is bigger than yours, so there!
 

 


#13 Tim D.

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Posted 11 June 2018 - 07:23 AM

As you may know in the bad old days when lotus were just starting out they decided to use a combination of crown wheel and pinion that we not perfectly matched. To "run them in" they used to fill the diff with metal polish and run then until they mad less noise. I am NOT recommending that you do this!
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#14 Mike C

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Posted 11 June 2018 - 07:33 AM

As you may know in the bad old days when lotus were just starting out they decided to use a combination of crown wheel and pinion that we not perfectly matched. To "run them in" they used to fill the diff with metal polish and run then until they mad less noise. I am NOT recommending that you do this!

And consumer protection laws have consigned the old dealer's  trick of adding sawdust/banana peels to the diff to history.


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#15 TriumphV8

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Posted 11 June 2018 - 01:04 PM

Thanks gents. After already laying out £800+ I’m seeing what my options are....

 It is more or less all hanging at the question if CWP is alredy damaged

and if where to get a good fresh one.

I recently got a nice new pair at 130 GBP.

Some are offered in the range up to 600GBP.

 

If the job is done with a proper setting it will be a 3 hours job.

If CWP is okay and you have an expert to judge that correctly

it is not much money to be added.

(Although a humming diff getting louder often is a bad indication)


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Cheers

Andreas


#16 GT6M

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Posted 12 June 2018 - 09:22 AM

Tek diff out, and blue it up,turn it owa with NO LOAD on it at all.

tek some pics.

 

then blue it agen, drive side and coast,  apply some resistance, a chisel between case an CW,so its v v tight t,turn.

so tight, it,ll need ye to pull a funny face,  and also some serious grunting wont go amiss either,                     as this,l show yer actually trying hard,

its gotta be like this,or its a waste of time.

its amazing hoo much a pattern can change

 

turn it over quite a few times,till there a good pattern showing, take some pics ,then,

bung em up here,let a few of us see em, then meb,e we can point ye in right direction,

 

it wont be too hard to alter things a wee bit,

 

but as said,if the CW/P is wearing,ye aint got much hope of a quieter diff.

butt,could be altered a wee bit.

and,the longer ye put it off, the moer chance it,ll never be able t,get made good agen

 

M


Edited by GT6M, 12 June 2018 - 09:27 AM.

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#17 michaeldavis39

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Posted 18 June 2018 - 12:20 PM

So a refurbed TR diff that was originally designed to run in a 100bhp TR6 has been installed into a TR6 with a Rover V8 engine and it's whining? Maybe I'm missing something here but was the refurbisher told it was going to be used on a Rover V8? Thought common sense would say you need to use a LSD with that engine which no one on here has mentioned. Sounds to me like someone is being a cheapskate on this one but then we've only heard one side of this story too haven't we folks- just saying- there are always two sides to every story and I believe it would be fair to hear what the refurbisher has to say instead of slagging him off when he hasn't had chance to defend himself!

Edited by michaeldavis39, 18 June 2018 - 12:21 PM.

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#18 Mike C

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Posted 18 June 2018 - 12:24 PM

Does this mean that we are going to hear from GT?


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#19 simonjrwinter

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Posted 18 June 2018 - 03:21 PM

Michael,

The rover v8 I have in my car is no more powerful than a standard TR6 ( and certainly faaaaar less than some of the tuned 6’s on here)yes the refurbisher (Gareth Thomas) was told it was in a car with a V8 before I even ordered it from him. He told me it would take all the power I could throw at it and certainly far more than I have. The car had the original 1971 Diff in it and has been fitted with the same Diff even though it was converted to a V8 in 1982!
I only took out the original Diff in 2016 after it started to weep oil.
Cheap skate....you having a laugh? I’ve paid over £800 and waited 10 months for Mr Thomas to build the “silent, leak free Diff” he promised, having to constantly nag and nag and getting nothing but abuse for my troubles. When it arrived ( in a cardboard box!)
It seeped oil and whined from day one. Sending it back wasn’t an option as I will NEVER HAVE ANYTHING TO DO WITH HIM AGAIN.
I understand that GT has been banned from posting here ( I wish I’d heard of his reputation BEFORE I sent him my money) so I doubt you’ll get a reply on here. If you manage to contact him, let me know, I have pages and pages of email excuses he sent me that I can share with you.

Simon
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...the oil stain under my TR is bigger than yours, so there!
 

 


#20 simonjrwinter

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Posted 18 June 2018 - 03:22 PM

Or you could try the Jaguar forums....( oh wait, he’s banned from all of those too)

Simon
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...the oil stain under my TR is bigger than yours, so there!
 

 





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