stuart Posted September 12, 2018 Report Share Posted September 12, 2018 (edited) Not sure that would work as theres a ramp on the wheel that operates the switch.you need to move that. Stuart. Edited September 12, 2018 by stuart Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RogerH Posted September 12, 2018 Author Report Share Posted September 12, 2018 Hi Stuart, I was going to follow up by saying that Richard71 and Google have shown that there is indeed a ramp under the gear wheel. This should pull off and be replaced 180' around the circ. I'm just in the process of making a support for the horseshoe to sit on that isn;t too ugly. However I have just had a big delivery lorry knock a very large branch off a tree outside the house. At least the driver stoped and put the branch on the pavement. Roger Quote Link to post Share on other sites
stuart Posted September 12, 2018 Report Share Posted September 12, 2018 Best way to mount the later wiper motor is to make a mount like the 6 has , fairly simple bracket that Im sure wouldnt be difficult for you to make. Stuart. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RogerH Posted September 12, 2018 Author Report Share Posted September 12, 2018 (edited) Hi Stuart, I have made something similar but using a solid plastic type material. Anyway this is now becoming a saga. The motor is mounted and looks good The electrics all work. The Park is in the right place.. So what could possibly be wrong. The new TR6 14W motor had 150' on the lid. I didn;t believe this and suspected it was 115' as it is specified as a TR6 motor. However this didn;t stop the wiper blades sweeping from one side to the other - past the screen rubber and hit the body rear of the bonnet = arrggghhhh. So perhaps it was a 150' wheel (but it isn't) No problem I have a spare 115' wheel courtesy of Pete Wigglesworth. So this was fitted. But again the bodywork got a got slapping. It took some head scratching but then the penny dropped (something similar to the 8" 'G' clamp on my foot - twice). The 115' is for a TR6. Guess what, the TR6 has a smaller diameter wheel box attached to the blades. So they need more push for the same angle - doh!!! So I now have a question - if a TR6 gear wheel stamped as 115' gives a very big sweep of the TR4A wheel box (in excess of 150') what size gearwheel do I need to get 120' sweep with the TR4A wheelbox.. I have done a simple equation 115 (TR6 gearwheel) is to 150 blade sweep that I have, as X is to 120 blade sweep , what I want. X= 115 x 120 / 150 - apprx 90' What a cherfuffle. Tomorrow will be another exciting day Roger Edited December 12, 2019 by RogerH Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Lebro Posted September 12, 2018 Report Share Posted September 12, 2018 The 115' is for a TR6. Guess what, the TR6 has a smaller diameter wheel box attached to the blades. So they need more push for the same angle - doh!!! Roger Surely that is the wrong way round, the TR6 would have a larger dia wheel attached to the blades to get a reduced sweep ? Bob. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RogerH Posted September 13, 2018 Author Report Share Posted September 13, 2018 Hi Bob, I see what you mean but I think I am right. The TR6 wheel box is smaller than the TFR4/4A box. The number on the 14W motor gear wheel (115) is for the required sweep on a TR6. So, the small wheel box needs more drive length on the cable. TRansfer this length to the bigger wheel box on the TR4/4A results in more rotation. So I think I need a 90' 14W gear wheel that has less length of push to rotate my bigger wheel boxes the correct amount. I ordered a 90' gear wheel this morning from SVC https://www.s-v-c.co.uk/product/14w-wiper-drive-gear/. To try and get a comparison I mounted a DR3 (120') gear wheel in the lathe and set a tool against the gear wheel arm post. I then fited the 14W (115') gear wheel in the chuck and the post over lapped the tool by a significant amount (apprx 1/3 diameter of the arm post). So the degree number stamped on the gear wheel indicates blade sweep with the correct wheel boxes. Tomorrow should be another fun day.. Roger Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Lebro Posted September 13, 2018 Report Share Posted September 13, 2018 Oh so you were referring to the gear wheel in the motor - I thought you were referring to the one connected to the wiper spindle. Bob. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RogerH Posted September 13, 2018 Author Report Share Posted September 13, 2018 Hi Bob, ideally when using the 14W motor one should change the wheel boxes (attached to the wiper blades) this then should reflect the angle number on the motor gear wheel. Roger Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RogerH Posted September 14, 2018 Author Report Share Posted September 14, 2018 Hi Folks, nothing sucks seeds better than a toothless budgie. Success - the wipers wipe (the crank cranks and the pistons go ....er ....up and down). The 14W TR6 wiper motor works very well on the TR4A. BUT if using the TR4A wheel boxes you will need the 90 or 95 degree gear wheel in the motor. 90 degree gives a good sweep - just short of the original 120'.. The 95 will give you a little more than the 120' sweep but will work fine. There are also two benefits to the 14W motor apart from the motor being a better more powerful design. 1 - reciprocating arm spigot on the gear wheel is closer to the centre so improving the power output (or is that torque) 2 - the wheel box gear diameter is bigger on the 4A and thus improves the power transfer to the blades - or is that torque again whatever there are two points that improve the power performance from motor to blade. So much so that the blades will sweep a dry screen - not possible on the 4A before hand. Now for the stupidity early this morning I had the bright idea to reposition the gear wheel spigot to allow a 4A 120 sweep. I took many dimension between the TR6 115 wheel and the TR4A wheel and came up with a dimension to place the spigot at. Within 15 minutes of the spigot being welded into its new position the postie turned up with the new gear wheel. You only have one shot at repositioning the spigot as there are only two park position. (unlike the 4A) One position is taken by the original spigot position. The second position is your final go. Anyway having welded the spigot into position I compared the original 4A motor gear wheel spigot with the modified TR6 gear wheel with the new spigot position - it is within 0.010" of being identical - so something like 122'. In playing around with the gear wheel I have found there are different versions of the parking ramp - the location spigots can be different. What other things will I get up to today. Roger Quote Link to post Share on other sites
SuzanneH Posted September 14, 2018 Report Share Posted September 14, 2018 Hi Folks, nothing sucks seeds better than a toothless budgie. Success - the wipers wipe (the crank cranks and the pistons go ....er ....up and down). The 14W TR6 wiper motor works very well on the TR4A. BUT if using the TR4A wheel boxes you will need the 90 or 95 degree gear wheel in the motor. 90 degree gives a good sweep - just short of the original 120'.. The 95 will give you a little more than the 120' sweep but will work fine. There are also two benefits to the 14W motor apart from the motor being a better more powerful design. 1 - reciprocating arm spigot on the gear wheel is closer to the centre so improving the power output (or is that torque) 2 - the wheel box gear diameter is bigger on the 4A and thus improves the power transfer to the blades - or is that torque again whatever there are two points that improve the power performance from motor to blade. So much so that the blades will sweep a dry screen - not possible on the 4A before hand. Now for the stupidity early this morning I had the bright idea to reposition the gear wheel spigot to allow a 4A 120 sweep. I took many dimension between the TR6 115 wheel and the TR4A wheel and came up with a dimension to place the spigot at. Within 15 minutes of the spigot being welded into its new position the postie turned up with the new gear wheel. You only have one shot at repositioning the spigot as there are only two park position. (unlike the 4A) One position is taken by the original spigot position. The second position is your final go. Anyway having welded the spigot into position I compared the original 4A motor gear wheel spigot with the modified TR6 gear wheel with the new spigot position - it is within 0.010" of being identical - so something like 122'. In playing around with the gear wheel I have found there are different versions of the parking ramp - the location spigots can be different. What other things will I get up to today. Roger Fitting the new headboard I hope and buying a new Gas eye level grill and oven. Even getting the Saab valeted so we could go to the Saab event at The Ace Cafe tomorrow would be good too. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RogerH Posted December 12, 2019 Author Report Share Posted December 12, 2019 Hi Folks, another update. Up till recently the 14W replacement has performed very well. However it is now not self parking as readily as I would like. Turn off the wipers at the switch and the blades continue to sweep for a randomly decided time by the wiper gods. On the 14W motor there is an external park switch. This slides on/off the motor body. Annoyingly the motor body is close to the bulkhead and does not allow this sliding action. Until I can see the switch I will not know what is going on (hopefully tomorrow) Under normal conditions the cam on the large gear wheel inside the motor runs over a pin on the switch to operate it. The cam runs over the pin continuously when operating so could it be wear and tear on cheap plastic parts. We shall see. Regarding the post above - we did go to the SAAB event. It was small and very friendly. Noce bunch of folk. Roger Quote Link to post Share on other sites
stuart Posted December 12, 2019 Report Share Posted December 12, 2019 2 hours ago, RogerH said: Hi Folks, another update. Up till recently the 14W replacement has performed very well. However it is now not self parking as readily as I would like. Turn off the wipers at the switch and the blades continue to sweep for a randomly decided time by the wiper gods. On the 14W motor there is an external park switch. This slides on/off the motor body. Annoyingly the motor body is close to the bulkhead and does not allow this sliding action. Until I can see the switch I will not know what is going on (hopefully tomorrow) Under normal conditions the cam on the large gear wheel inside the motor runs over a pin on the switch to operate it. The cam runs over the pin continuously when operating so could it be wear and tear on cheap plastic parts. We shall see. Regarding the post above - we did go to the SAAB event. It was small and very friendly. Noce bunch of folk. Roger The plastic park switch is often the culprit, I have had to replace one or two, I suspect thats why its available as a spare although only in clip on version, the screw on version is NLS. Stuart. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RogerH Posted December 13, 2019 Author Report Share Posted December 13, 2019 Hi Folks, it was the 1.5 year old switch. On the bench , removed from the motor body, it work reliably/repeatedly. However when installed it did not work. The cam on the large gear wheel looked in good condition. I can only think that the actuator pin was worn down a tad. I have an idea for a contactless sensor I have started a new thread in the general forum regarding fitting a new switch Roger Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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