RogerH Posted August 14, 2017 Report Share Posted August 14, 2017 Hi Folks, I'm slowly whittling away at the various oil leaks. This morning I found the source of a beauty. The alignment arm on the off side of the OD has a small river Thames running down from it. I see on the Moss WebCat that there is an O ring under it #55 http://www.moss-europe.co.uk/shop-by-model/triumph/tr2-4a/clutch-transmission-drivetrain/overdrives-components/overdrive-units-components-tr2-4a.html Can this be replaced by 'simply' removing the arm and picking it out. Or do I have to take the diff out Roger Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Graham Harris Posted August 14, 2017 Report Share Posted August 14, 2017 Hi Roger, just knock the pin out with care, take the arm off and you can pick the o ring out. Graham Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Fireman049 Posted August 14, 2017 Report Share Posted August 14, 2017 +1. Roger, it should be OK as Graham states. I can't see any other way of replacing the 'O' ring. Tom. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Lebro Posted August 14, 2017 Report Share Posted August 14, 2017 I think there was a topic on this one recently ? Bob. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
stuart Posted August 14, 2017 Report Share Posted August 14, 2017 Do make sure that you get the correct one as the supplied one didnt used to be and would stop the overdrive dis-engaging. Stuart. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RogerH Posted August 14, 2017 Author Report Share Posted August 14, 2017 (edited) Hi Folks, the simple job to replace a small O ring can get complex indeed. To replace/renew I need to remove the OD alignment jigging pin lever/arm. This is held in with a roll pin. This pin has probably been there for the last 55 years - can you believe that the pin does not want to simply knock out. I don;t want to really bash it in case the shaft gets bent. So, any tips out there to move the roll pin ? it has been well oiled over the last couple of years. I may have to make some sort of extractor thingy. Roger Edited August 14, 2017 by RogerH Quote Link to post Share on other sites
stillp Posted August 14, 2017 Report Share Posted August 14, 2017 I think you should make some sort of extractor thingy. Go on, you know you want to. Pete Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RogerH Posted August 14, 2017 Author Report Share Posted August 14, 2017 Hi Pete, your wish is my command. Using CAD (cardboard aided design) I have come up with an idea for tomorrow. Roger Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Fireman049 Posted August 14, 2017 Report Share Posted August 14, 2017 Come on Roger ~ you know you can do it!! Tom. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RobTR3 Posted August 14, 2017 Report Share Posted August 14, 2017 Roger Quite recently I changed both O' rings either end of the operating shaft. The one you are referring to behind the adjustment lever I thought would be the most straight forward! I had a job like yourself trying to get the roll pin out. After some effort from under the car and inside (I had the tunnel off) it did come out by drifting it out from inside the vehicle i.e top of the lever to ground - if you see what I mean. The pin has a slight taper so will only come out one way. My hammering from below was therefore pointless. Your set-up is probably the same. Now at this point you will think you are winning because the lever will now slide along the operating shaft. In my case, however, the lever abuts the floor/tunnel sections so it will not slide off. Fortunately, as I had the tunnel off I was able to get enough clearance by levering down the floor section with a large screwdriver under the overdrive unit and pressing down the floor section! Enough clearance then to slide the lever off. The O'ring is then picked out easily. In my case the O'ring was quite hard on it's edges thus failing to seal properly. Hope this helps. Rob Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RogerH Posted August 14, 2017 Author Report Share Posted August 14, 2017 Hi Rob, thanks for that. So the seal is hidden inside the casting boss where the shaft goes through. That explains a lot. So both sides need loosening off and the shaft being move sideways enough to get at the hidden O ring. Is there any danger of the cam etc becoming lost inside.? Roger Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RobTR3 Posted August 14, 2017 Report Share Posted August 14, 2017 Roger Yes!! I thought of that but was put off by the knowledge that the operating valve would drop off the cam on the operating shaft into the overdrive unit. However, as long as this is removed, in theory you could by removing the solenoid/solenoid bracket slide the operating shaft across - not sure though whether the tunnel/floor section will again give enough clearance. Additionally, when undoing the nuts (2) and studs(2) you will find this a b&$@er to do without the tunnel off. The solenoid bracket is pressed against by the accumulator spring so the nuts/studs have to be taken off evenly, they are not easy to get at without the tunnel off. The other issue in sliding the operating shaft is losing the cam position relative to the operating valve. You'd have to test it's position with a long thin screwdriver before dropping the operating valve back in. If I had to do this again I'd definitely go to the trouble of taking the tunnel off, especially if your changing both O'rings. Easier to get at the job and adjust the solenoid. Rob Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RogerH Posted August 14, 2017 Author Report Share Posted August 14, 2017 Hi Rob, thanks for more info - what are you doing tomorrow morning - just pop round and give me a hand Roger Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RobTR3 Posted August 14, 2017 Report Share Posted August 14, 2017 Roger I'd love to pop over, more than willing, but I am a bit far away for that! Tomorrow I'm even further away in Tenby. Take the tunnel off, you'll find it an easier job. Rob PS Should have said nuts/bolts (2 of each). Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Ben Freer Posted August 14, 2017 Report Share Posted August 14, 2017 Just thump it Roger! You know you want to ???? If it knows you are determined from the off it will be quivering all night and plop out as soon as you threaten it with a ball/pein hammer and a drift ???????? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RogerH Posted August 15, 2017 Author Report Share Posted August 15, 2017 Hi Rob, the tunnel is off so no problem with access. Hi Ben, I admire your 'go for it' attitude. And when the shaft snaps I will come to you and you will do what exactly I have a simple plan for this morning and a more complex plan if the first fails Roger Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Ben Freer Posted August 15, 2017 Report Share Posted August 15, 2017 Roger You have a PM ???? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RogerH Posted August 15, 2017 Author Report Share Posted August 15, 2017 Thanks Ben Roger Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RogerH Posted August 15, 2017 Author Report Share Posted August 15, 2017 I think you should make some sort of extractor thingy. Go on, you know you want to. Pete Hi Pete, spent a couple of hours this morning making the extractor tool. It started out rather neat but it soon became necessary to fettle it on order to get it to fit. The major diameter on the shaft isn't round more rugby ball shapoed - so I had to drag the hole. Thankfully all the important holes all lined up. It didn't appear to work to start with so I spent some time with a decent pin punch hitting in both directions. This did no good. So I went back to the tool and bingo it started to go. Finished off with the pin punch. Roger This shows the screw hole aligned with the mills pin The tool sitting on the arm This shows the raggedy holes with the screw and nipple to push on the pin This shows the arm sitting in the tool - if only I had the arm before I did the machining. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Lebro Posted August 15, 2017 Report Share Posted August 15, 2017 Good work. Bob. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RogerH Posted August 16, 2017 Author Report Share Posted August 16, 2017 Hi Bob, it would have looked nice in the finished/machined condition but the odd shape of the arm called for hand fettling - but it all lined up and worked. The 'Mills' pin that goes through the arm/shaft is tapered and out of stock at Moss. I thought I had aced it yesterday when my local aladin's cave said they have them. Sadly not - out of stock - but they did have roll pins. Roll pins are slightly different in the they are oversize for the hole and swine to push in. Also the hole is tapered. So rather than open the hole I will machine down a 1/8" drill shank and make my own 'Mills' pin. I will make th ehead end longer than needed that way the next person to remove it will know which way to extract. Another concern is the O ring. I have the Moss O ring and it is sold as the part for the job Stuart warns about getting the right one, else it may be too stiff. The old ones looked as if they have a square cross section (new ones are the normal round shape) is this just the shape after years in position? Should they be round or square. ? What about Q seals in this position? Roger . Quote Link to post Share on other sites
stuart Posted August 16, 2017 Report Share Posted August 16, 2017 (edited) IIRC they should be square section, the round ones are the ones that gave us the problem. Try talking to ORS. Stuart. Edited August 16, 2017 by stuart Quote Link to post Share on other sites
AlanG Posted August 16, 2017 Report Share Posted August 16, 2017 FWIW the pin used for fixing the 3rd/4th selector rod end is a grooved pin. Not sure if it was tapered or not. http://www.keysandpins.com/products/groove-pins?page=shop.browse&category_id=89&gclid=CP7hqNOp29UCFfgV0wodrlsBjg Alan. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RogerH Posted August 16, 2017 Author Report Share Posted August 16, 2017 IIRC they should be square section, the round ones are the ones that gave us the problem. Try talking to ORS. Stuart. Bu99er - I didn't realise they would be square until last night when I took them out. I was hoping that my square ones had been distorted with age. Never mind, I'l button it up and see about the correct seals 'toot sweet' - why do people sell the wrong items. Roger Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RogerH Posted August 16, 2017 Author Report Share Posted August 16, 2017 Hi Folks, I think I have a problem. The solenoid has been reconnected and the rigging arm has the 3/16" pin in place and it all looks good. The problem is that with the rigging pin removed the arm can now rotate much further clockwise until it comes to a very solid stop. Previous, before the seal change, the arm would get to the rigging pin hole and then feel springy and only go a little way past the alignment position. Is it because there is no oil in the OD and every thing is relaxed. OR have I got something misaligned inside the OD I may well need to take it apart again if the round O rings leak or seize. so it would be good to know where I am. Roger Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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