Guest chris jameson Posted January 9, 2006 Report Share Posted January 9, 2006 Hi All, I turned into my street last night and noticed the control head turning with the steering wheel. Not a good thing.. The head is finger tight, and turns freely with the wheel. It was previously tight... I have checked the three screws which go through the steering wheel (they are tight), and I am about to take the assembly off. Does anyone have any hints as to where the problem may be? The control head is a replica...and has given good service for two years Cheers, Chris 1960 TR3A TS 78655 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Don Elliott Posted January 9, 2006 Report Share Posted January 9, 2006 It is possible that the embossed "key" on the long tube that contains the 4 wires going down the inside of your steering column has broken off or become flat. Or possibly the long tube has fractured all the way around near that point. In the meantime, read all about it in the excellent work that Clive Elsdon in England has put together : - http://www.tr-register.com.au/Files/technical.htm Then click on the topic about 5 items down. Don Elliott, Montreal Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Guest chris jameson Posted January 9, 2006 Report Share Posted January 9, 2006 It is possible that the embossed "key" on the long tube that contains the 4 wires going down the inside of your steering column has broken off or become flat. Or possibly the long tube has fractured all the way around near that point. In the meantime, read all about it in the excellent work that Clive Elsdon in England has put together : - http://www.tr-register.com.au/Files/technical.htm Then click on the topic about 5 items down. Don Elliott, Montreal Thanks Don, I'll check that... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Geoff Carter Posted January 9, 2006 Report Share Posted January 9, 2006 Word of advice. If you take of the steering wheel control head, have a look to see that the copper washer behind the horn push is still firmly attached. Mine came loose actually during an MOT test and I had to return home, dismantle and fix it which as we all know is a fiddly job with limited access to the fixing screws. This happened with a 6 year old replica unit. Just remember to use limited force as these units are weak and expensive, Geoff Carter TR2 TS1923 RYD 761 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Menno van Rij Posted January 9, 2006 Report Share Posted January 9, 2006 When I bougth my TR, the control head had the same problem. Eventually I discovered that the thin tube inside the steering colomn was broken, just at the position where the tube enters the control head. There's a cut (about 5 cm long) where the inner tube slots over the embossed key inside the c.h.. The fracture was just at the end of the cut. Anyway, when it's completely broken, you can check it: it must be possible to move the control head a little by pulling it towards you and pushing it back into the steering wheel, since it's no longer connected to the other end of the tube that's secured by the copper nut. Be careful though: by pulling the control head towards you, you 'll also pull the electrical wires at the end of the steering tube... It wasn't easy to buy an other inner tube overhere in Holland, at my Triumph parts supplier. Eventually I went to a engineering company in my hometown. They had the right size tube 'on the shelf' and where willing to make me a new one. Study the old inner tubing carefully when you pull it out of your car. There are two small metal 'springs' (I would like to call them). They prevent the inner tubing from chafing (is that the correct word in English?) against the inner wall of the steering colomn. What's equally important: these springs are held in place by a profile cut out of the inner tubing. Well, you'll see what I mean when your disconnecting all. Menno Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Guest chris jameson Posted January 9, 2006 Report Share Posted January 9, 2006 (edited) When I bougth my TR, the control head had the same problem. Eventually I discovered that the thin tube inside the steering colomn was broken, just at the position where the tube enters the control head. There's a cut (about 5 cm long) where the inner tube slots over the embossed key inside the c.h.. The fracture was just at the end of the cut. Anyway, when it's completely broken, you can check it: it must be possible to move the control head a little by pulling it towards you and pushing it back into the steering wheel, since it's no longer connected to the other end of the tube that's secured by the copper nut. Be careful though: by pulling the control head towards you, you 'll also pull the electrical wires at the end of the steering tube... It wasn't easy to buy an other inner tube overhere in Holland, at my Triumph parts supplier. Eventually I went to a engineering company in my hometown. They had the right size tube 'on the shelf' and where willing to make me a new one. Study the old inner tubing carefully when you pull it out of your car. There are two small metal 'springs' (I would like to call them). They prevent the inner tubing from chafing (is that the correct word in English?) against the inner wall of the steering colomn. What's equally important: these springs are held in place by a profile cut out of the inner tubing. Well, you'll see what I mean when your disconnecting all. Menno Thanks for the tips....as you say Geoff, those repro control heads cost an arm and a leg, so I will not be happy if the thing has come apart... I won't get a chance to dismantle it for a few more days, as I am back at work this week Oh well, the self cancelling mechanism never worked either... Cheers, Chris Edited January 9, 2006 by chris jameson Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Don Elliott Posted January 10, 2006 Report Share Posted January 10, 2006 If the self-cancelling feature is not working, it has been wrongly assembled. Inside the control head there are two 1/16" thick plates which make a parallel gap, one with the other. They are pointed so as to have the appearance of one item pointing upward together. The clicker has to sit in the gap between these two pointed plates. For a while, after I rebuilt mine, it would cancel when I was turning left but never when turning right. So I took it all apart again and since I re-set the clicker lever in between the two pointed plates, it has cancelled just fine. I re-checked Clive's excellent treatise and we can see the chromed clicker lever, but he doesn't show the two pointed plates mentioned above. Don Elliott, Original Owner, 1958 TR3A Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Guest chris jameson Posted January 11, 2006 Report Share Posted January 11, 2006 Thanks again Don.... I have not had the chance to pull it apart yet, but I am hoping for an easy fix....we are at the height of TR weather down here... Cheers, Chris P.S. Nice TR photo from 1958..... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
james christie Posted January 11, 2006 Report Share Posted January 11, 2006 Before you pull it all to bits, just check that the brass nut on the bottom side of the steering box is not loose This clamps up the stator tube by means of an olive. Make sure that it is threaded on properly by using fingers only before tightening up with a spanner - being brass, the thread is very easily stripped james christie Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Guest chris jameson Posted January 13, 2006 Report Share Posted January 13, 2006 Thanks James, That was indeed the problem The brass nut was finger tight on the stator tube at the steering box.....I tightened it up and the control head is firm again. My poor workmanship from two years ago...I tightened the nut quite firmly at the time, but not too tight for fear of stripping the thread... Saved a lot of work! Cheers and thanks again... Chris Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Menno van Rij Posted January 13, 2006 Report Share Posted January 13, 2006 There's a chance that the steering box lubrication has dripped away when the brass nut was lose. In that case you'll have to refill with (the right sort of) oil by using the filler hole halfway up the steering colomn. The hole is protected by a rubber grommit. I've read somewhere that the so called 'splash lubrication' is not sufficient. Therefore, you'll have to fill the 'box and the column all the way up until the lubrication oil inside the steering colomn has reached the filler hole. (Be aware though, I couldn't find the article where I've read this. So, has anyone any comment on this?) Menno Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Mychael Posted January 14, 2006 Report Share Posted January 14, 2006 You'd have your work cut out trying to fill the whole thing. Have you ever seen how viscous the correct oil is?? It's a semi liquid grease. It's so thick you can safely take the top off the steering box and fill it in that way. You can try to pour it but you need to get it very (and I do mean very) hot if you want to try to get it to flow down the pipe. Mychael Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Menno van Rij Posted January 14, 2006 Report Share Posted January 14, 2006 (edited) Mychael, Off course you could be right, but a few weeks back I found and bought a 1959 original workshop manual (in Dutch) as used by the Dutch Triumph dealers of that era. It says on page 51/52 (translated in English off course) that you have to use EP-transmission oil, type SAE 90 by temperatures above 32 F ( 0 Celsius) and type SAE 80 below 32 F. IMHO EP tranny oil SAE 90 or 80 is somewhat liquid and can be pored out of a can. On the other hand, after reading your post, I remember seeing a TR3A with it's steering house disconnected and opened and there I saw a sort of black grease, somewhat like Molykote. You can see the confusion! Menno Edited January 15, 2006 by Menno van Rij Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Don Elliott Posted January 15, 2006 Report Share Posted January 15, 2006 (edited) I have always used oil in my steering box. But once, when I was putting it back together, I tightened the 4 bolts and bent the front plate (the one where the 4 wires come through) and later when I filled it, the oil leaked out because it was bent. I took it off and flattened it and lapped it flat again so it wouldn't leak and it's been OK for years. I seem to remember that there is a grease that is sold in UK for the steering gearbox. Maybe it's because the oil leaks out of some of them. Don Edited January 15, 2006 by Don Elliott Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BrianC Posted January 15, 2006 Report Share Posted January 15, 2006 I seem to remember that there is a grease that is sold in UK for the steering gearbox. Maybe it's because the oil leaks out of some of them. Don Most of the classic car specialists sell it e.g. Moss: PENRITE STEERING BOX LUBE 0.5L GGL9028X £6.65 €10.11 I've never used as I assume it's a recent invention, and I have never had problems filling or leaks with the standard hypoy. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Mychael Posted January 15, 2006 Report Share Posted January 15, 2006 (edited) Menno, An Ep oil would pour (albeit slowly) but as Brain C mentioned it is the Penrite stuff I was refferring to. Very very heavy, almost like a grease and only semi liquid.. Mychael Edited January 15, 2006 by Mychael Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Guest chris jameson Posted January 18, 2006 Report Share Posted January 18, 2006 Hi Guys, Sorry about the lag...I am currently enjoying the Australian summer at the coast, and away from the Net. Yes, I use the Penrite Steering Box lube, and I sit the bottle in a saucepan of boiling water for a few minutes, so the grease turns into an oil like substance. I then suck it up into a big syringe with a bit of plastic tubing attached, and inject this into the hole in the column. The substance then rapidly solidifies into its grease state. I have never had a leak....except now of course, with the loose nut. I will fix it when I get back home.... Cheers all... Chris Quote Link to post Share on other sites
jonlar Posted January 18, 2006 Report Share Posted January 18, 2006 Sorry about the lag...I am currently enjoying the Australian summer at the coast Hi Chris, have one in the sun for all of us, and a beer! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Guest chris jameson Posted January 19, 2006 Report Share Posted January 19, 2006 Cheers Jonlar, and all our Northern Friends... from Apollo Bay, on Victoria's South Coast....it's going to be 41C tomorrow, with a southerly change in the afternoon... Surfs up! Cheers, Chris Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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