Fireman049 Posted June 17, 2015 Report Share Posted June 17, 2015 Can anyone recommend a good soldering gun (trigger operated). I bought one on the net but it didn't produce much heat and was complete rubbish so back it went. Tom. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
AlanT Posted June 17, 2015 Report Share Posted June 17, 2015 What's it for Tom? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Fireman049 Posted June 17, 2015 Author Report Share Posted June 17, 2015 Hi Alan ~ It's for rewiring the TR. Tom. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Nigel Lay Posted June 17, 2015 Report Share Posted June 17, 2015 Hi Tom, I'm still about!!! Weller 9200ud for a single heat, but if you can justify it a weller DP650 dual heat. I have had the dual heat one for over 30 years now and it's still going strong and a great tool. Use lead (60/40) solder or 37/63 as some now call it. Nigel Quote Link to post Share on other sites
flinty Posted June 17, 2015 Report Share Posted June 17, 2015 Hello Tom. I have a Weller 100VA and it is excellent. Costs a bit more but is well worth it. Steve. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Don H. Posted June 17, 2015 Report Share Posted June 17, 2015 I've used a pecil iron (a 33W/120V Ungar 7760) for over thirty years now. There are lots of equivalent products by companies like Weller and others. A pencil iron is useful because it can give more control in tight spots. A downside (a minor one, IMO) is that the tip doesn't heat and cool as fast as an inductively-heated gun, so one has to be careful putting it back in a holder. Although it's not always possible on our cars, there's a considerable body of thinking that crimped connections are more durable than soldered -- talk to an aircraft mechanic, for example. Some good auto mechanics I know will both crimp and solder. I use crimping only everywhere I can, and solder only where I have to. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Fireman049 Posted June 17, 2015 Author Report Share Posted June 17, 2015 Thank you all gentlemen ~ very helpful ~ Tom. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
stuart Posted June 17, 2015 Report Share Posted June 17, 2015 I crimp and solder and use one of these http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/T1-Bulk-Portasol-Technic-Butane-Gas-Soldering-Iron-fitted-with-2-4mm-Tip-/221577590141?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item33970db57dtHA That way you can use it anywhere without having wires dragging. I have had mine for 30yrs and its brilliant. Best Irish invention. Stuart. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Fireman049 Posted June 17, 2015 Author Report Share Posted June 17, 2015 Hi Stuart ~ That's a very handy piece of equipment. How do you refill it? Tom. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Kevo_6 Posted June 17, 2015 Report Share Posted June 17, 2015 I crimp and solder and use one of these http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/T1-Bulk-Portasol-Technic-Butane-Gas-Soldering-Iron-fitted-with-2-4mm-Tip-/221577590141?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item33970db57dtHA That way you can use it anywhere without having wires dragging. I have had mine for 30yrs and its brilliant. Best Irish invention. Stuart. +1 Had mine for years too. Handy for shrink wrapping too. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
TR NIALL Posted June 17, 2015 Report Share Posted June 17, 2015 Spot On Stuart great bit of Kit,Tom it's filled with Cigarette Lighter Gas. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Kevo_6 Posted June 17, 2015 Report Share Posted June 17, 2015 Hi Stuart ~ That's a very handy piece of equipment. How do you refill it? Tom. I use something similar to this. (sorry to jump in Stuart) http://www.maplin.co.uk/p/butane-gas-refill-200ml-n59an Quote Link to post Share on other sites
AlanT Posted June 17, 2015 Report Share Posted June 17, 2015 Your problem will be too much heat rather than too little, unless you are working outside in the wind. I'd just be using a 30W Antex. Unless you switch to high tech wire the PVC insulation typically used tends to melt and run back. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
MikeF Posted June 19, 2015 Report Share Posted June 19, 2015 (edited) The advantage of a gun is that it heats instantly, thereafter you have a fairly clunky tool which is not well controlled for temperature, is relatively easily chilled on heavier work and the tip shape is not ideal for efficient heat transfer. So for one off joints handy, but for multiple soldering joints I would recommend a regular iron. Like Stuart and others I use a gas powered tool for wiring for the reasons given, for more critical electronics I use electric. Lucas did a study some years ago where they found crimping terminations more reliable than soldering, but this was a statistical thing based on mass production results. For domestic applications - unless you have a proper crimping tool - I would recommend soldering. If you are going to crimp then do not pre-tin the wire terminations first. The solder will "creep" over the years relaxing the crimp and at best you will not have a gas tight bond. It will therefore tend to oxidise and go high resistance. Soldering a crimped connection is OK but OTT IMO So far as the solder is concerned try to find 63/37 (That's 63% tin 37% lead). It’s slightly better than the 60/40. The cost difference is marginal Maplins sell it but you have to look or ask. Either is better than lead free. Lead free solders have a higher melting point and tend not to wet/spread as readily as tin/leads. Contrary to what you might thinkthere is no environmental or health benefit in lead free solder, but it does cost more. (unless you overheat the lead in a torch or similar) Lead-free solder comes in two main types: Tin copper melting from 227C and a silver containing version from 217C which is slightly better to solder with. Tin/lead goes at 183C, so you can see you will need a higher bit temperature with either unleaded type and with that comes the possibility of thermal damage to insulation etc. Mike Edited June 19, 2015 by MikeF Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RogerH Posted June 20, 2015 Report Share Posted June 20, 2015 (edited) Hi Folks, first hand experience - two weeks ago in the Lakes heading to the midge nest my Hi-T starter motor played silly bu99ers. The internal contact where the external wire feeds the solenoid had snapped. I used a 12V/30W pencil tip and in the outside it was only just powerful enough to melt the solder and heat the relatively large terminal. A 60W with a blunt end would have been better or the gas gun as it replaces the heat quicker. Although you don't want to overheat the wire and sleeving you do need a good heat source to 'bang' into the wire to do a quick job. Most looms over a couple of year will have iffy/contaminated copper strand - you need a good flux to break through or use a very sharp blade to scrape the strands clean. What is best - crimp or solder Firstly if you solder DO NOT crimp afterwards. The crimp will loosen and you will damage the solder joint. If you crimp then you can solder - but why!! If the crimp was iffy then you only have a solder joint. ALL aerospace cabling is crimped - not with a pair of knackered pliers and not with the cheap bullet crimper but with quality crimpers that give a hexagonal squeeze. Use the correct size bullet and cable Solder requires flux; flux is corrosive - after a few years it will bite you in the bum. If you need to do an inline connection of large cables (brown alternator cable) then always consider a decent crimp and the current running through it. These are neat and tidy. I have actually used copper tube for the crimp with heatshrink over the top. High current and heat can also make a solder joint 'dry'. This will cause rapid failure (have a look inside any old 70's TV) Having said that my car has a selection of the above - a bit like a test bed (or was it idleness) Roger Edited June 20, 2015 by RogerH Quote Link to post Share on other sites
peejay4A Posted June 20, 2015 Report Share Posted June 20, 2015 When I were a lad I was advised to use a high power soldering iron even for small scale work. The theory was that the connection got hot quickly and the solder flowed quickly before any heat conduction affected the attached component. The corollary being that if you use a low powered iron it takes longer for the joint to get up to temperature and during the extended warm up heat is being transferred to the component. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Lebro Posted June 20, 2015 Report Share Posted June 20, 2015 +1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BlueTR3A-5EKT Posted June 20, 2015 Report Share Posted June 20, 2015 Flux When I used to make pin beading (for cars and upholstery) this is what I used instead of the highly corrosive 'frys' no 1 or 3 http://www.laco.com/soldering-fluxes/brite-regular-flux-liquid/ For soldering galvanised nails into a lead bead it was the dog's Peter W Quote Link to post Share on other sites
stillp Posted June 21, 2015 Report Share Posted June 21, 2015 The best kind of soldering iron is a high wattage (60W or greater) temperature-controlled type such as the Weller TCP. However, on car wiring I would prefer not to solder, but to crimp instead. As Roger and others have said, don't do both, and get a proper ratchet crimper. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
MikeF Posted June 21, 2015 Report Share Posted June 21, 2015 Flux When I used to make pin beading (for cars and upholstery) this is what I used instead of the highly corrosive 'frys' no 1 or 3 http://www.laco.com/soldering-fluxes/brite-regular-flux-liquid/ For soldering galvanised nails into a lead bead it was the dog's Peter W Laco make good products but as a general rule any flux you can buy in a jar is not safe for electrical and electronic work. They will solder just fine because they are highly active chemicals. Unfortunately after soldering that activity will still be there and continue to chew away at your wiring. The flux in cored solder wire - the type you buy in Maplins, RS etc - should be perfectly OK for car wiring. If it is not then a gentle scrape with fine Wet and dry to brighten the metal is all that is needed. The residues after soldering will be safe. The practical difference in long term reliability between soldered and crimped connections when done properly isn't really relevant to most of us, after all the soldered connections on our cars have lasted 50 years or so. You would be taking a very long term view to switch to crimping. In either case you must use the proper tools and technique, crimping with a pair off pliers is just like using too small a soldering iron. Mike Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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