RogerH Posted August 5, 2015 Report Share Posted August 5, 2015 Hi Kev, sounds like a nightmare. I had something similar a long while ago on the 4A. New cross shaft, doubled up on the cross shaft bearings in th bell housing Bronze bearing carrier Quality RHP bearing (£60 ) Pressure plate/friction plate from a good source - I tend to go for TRShop clutch parts. Is the bell housing aligned to the engine with the two dowels? Roger Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Kevo_6 Posted August 5, 2015 Author Report Share Posted August 5, 2015 Hi Kev, sounds like a nightmare. I had something similar a long while ago on the 4A. New cross shaft, doubled up on the cross shaft bearings in th bell housing Bronze bearing carrier Quality RHP bearing (£60 ) Pressure plate/friction plate from a good source - I tend to go for TRShop clutch parts. Is the bell housing aligned to the engine with the two dowels? Roger Hi Roger I have fitted so far a new Moss B&B clutch kit which came with a RHP bearing, a new steel carrier which was very hard steel (not sure if I should order a bronze carrier, are they better to use?), new release fork pivot pins (should I order a new release fork?), new doubled up cross shaft bushes and drilled cross shaft for a roll pin, new taper bolt, I used the original cross shaft (should I order a new one?) I fitted the Gear Box with new bolts from Moss with the correct dowel bolts first and torqued up. This will be the gearbox out 3 times in just under a year and I have probably only done about a 1000 miles . Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RogerH Posted August 5, 2015 Report Share Posted August 5, 2015 (edited) HI kev, I once fitted the steel carrier on my 4A and it was awful - don;t know why. Went back to the bronze carrier and it OK. I put it down the the carrier but could have been other things. Is the crass shaft stright - can't see it being the problem though. Out of interest - was your RHP bearing expensive £50+ Moss do a cheaper bearing that could be iffy. When you take the GB out have a look at the wear pattern on the diaphragm fingers. Roger PS - do you use a return spring on the cross shaft - if yes remove it. The RHP bearing is designed to keep rotating or there abouts. Edited August 5, 2015 by RogerH Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Kevo_6 Posted August 5, 2015 Author Report Share Posted August 5, 2015 HI kev, I once fitted the steel carrier on my 4A and it was awful - don;t know why. Went back to the bronze carrier and it OK. I put it down the the carrier but could have been other things. Is the crass shaft stright - can't see it being the problem though. Out of interest - was your RHP bearing expensive £50+ Moss do a cheaper bearing that could be iffy. When you take the GB out have a look at the wear pattern on the diaphragm fingers. Roger PS - do you use a return spring on the cross shaft - if yes remove it. The RHP bearing is designed to keep rotating or there abouts. Hi Roger, thanks for your reply. I am pretty sure the cross shaft is straight, the release bearing was part of a kit but I think the bearing price was only £22.00 ish. Who is doing the better bearings at the moment? I seem to recall that the diaphragm fingers had some uneven wear marks i.e. only on half of them. At the time (2 months ago when it was last out) I sort of put it down to the carrier tilting. Is there any clues here? No return spring on the cross shaft. Many Thanks. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RogerH Posted August 5, 2015 Report Share Posted August 5, 2015 Hi Kev, Moss do both a cheap (£20) and expensive (£50ish) bearing and both appear to be RHP (not too sure about that one) My £50 bearing was fitted July 2014 and appears to be doing well - 15K miles Roger Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Kevo_6 Posted August 5, 2015 Author Report Share Posted August 5, 2015 Hi Kev, Moss do both a cheap (£20) and expensive (£50ish) bearing and both appear to be RHP (not too sure about that one) My £50 bearing was fitted July 2014 and appears to be doing well - 15K miles Roger Sorry Roger can't seem to find the £50ish one on the Moss site, do you have a link to it? Thanks Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Chilp3 Posted August 5, 2015 Report Share Posted August 5, 2015 Hi Kev, Without wishing to add more variables to the mix I have recently gone through this pain with my TR6. I decided to fit the Revington uprated release bearing together with the Revington phosphor bronze carrier both of which have performed very well since. The release carrier doesn't have a pin in the groove which allows it to spin freely on the input shaft. I'm told is better although I'm sure other may have different opinions. I did also replace pretty much everything else in the bell-housing while I was there including as you have done a full set of bolts. I'm sorry to see that you may have to remove the box for a third time but trust you will finally get to the route cause of the problem. Best Regards, Peter Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Kevo_6 Posted August 5, 2015 Author Report Share Posted August 5, 2015 Thanks Peter, That's a coincidence, I was just looking at those 2 pieces a moment ago and added them to the shopping basket. Hoping to get the gearbox out tonight so I can check the other components. What clutch plate and diaphragm cover did you use? 3rd time lucky I suppose Quote Link to post Share on other sites
simonjrwinter Posted August 5, 2015 Report Share Posted August 5, 2015 I feel your pain...had my gearbox out SIX TIMES before I found out the squeaking release bearing (x4) was actually loose rivets in the clutch! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Kevo_6 Posted August 5, 2015 Author Report Share Posted August 5, 2015 I feel your pain...had my gearbox out SIX TIMES before I found out the squeaking release bearing (x4) was actually loose rivets in the clutch! Thanks for the tip Simon, another thing to look for. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Kevo_6 Posted August 5, 2015 Author Report Share Posted August 5, 2015 The gearbox is out. Started on my own from scratch at 6:45pm out by 9:15pm, well happy, my heads banging but worth it. Can't see any probs at the moment but will take the clutch out in the morning to see if anything is loose, bent etc. Anything else I could look for or check. Many thanks. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
simonjrwinter Posted August 5, 2015 Report Share Posted August 5, 2015 You've read the buckeye triumph site twice?..... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Kevo_6 Posted August 5, 2015 Author Report Share Posted August 5, 2015 You've read the buckeye triumph site twice?..... I've read it a dozen times of more Simon, still not got a clue but I will definitely check out for loose rivets etc. tomorrow. I find the creaking a bit weird, I can only think it's coming from the diaphragm fingers but I suppose loose rivets will make it creak. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
TR NIALL Posted August 5, 2015 Report Share Posted August 5, 2015 Make sure the Bearing Carrier is the Correct one,the Dolomite one is very similar but needs 2 square Washers on the Pins that carry the Bearing to take up play. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Kevo_6 Posted August 5, 2015 Author Report Share Posted August 5, 2015 Make sure the Bearing Carrier is the Correct one,the Dolomite one is very similar but needs 2 square Washers on the Pins that carry the Bearing to take up play. Thanks Niall, I was thinking of getting a bronze carrier and uprated release bearing from Revington's but not sure on the rest just yet. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Kevo_6 Posted August 6, 2015 Author Report Share Posted August 6, 2015 I removed the clutch plate etc. this morning and cant seem to see anything a miss. I will have a closer look tonight, there is some wear on the fingers of the pressure plate not sure if this is the problem. The only thing I will say is that the clutch was creaking and sticking HOT & COLD. Any other tips please... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Chilp3 Posted August 6, 2015 Report Share Posted August 6, 2015 Hi kev, Coming back to you on your earlier question. I fitted a Borg & Beck clutch assembly supplied by TRGB with the Revington uprated release bearing and phosphor bronze carrier. As I previously commented I also replaced everything in the bell-housing for good measure. I also replaced the input shaft oil seal while the box was out which had been leaking for some time. I am pleased with the results so far with the clutch being much lighter in operation and very precise. Good luck and please let us know the outcome. Best Regards, Peter Quote Link to post Share on other sites
graeme Posted August 6, 2015 Report Share Posted August 6, 2015 (edited) Hi Kev, I use the Koyo bearing from Revington which has proven to be good and can highly recommend. I can't see anything wrong in your pictures, the wear on the fingers looks normal. Cheers Graeme Edited August 6, 2015 by graeme Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Kevo_6 Posted August 6, 2015 Author Report Share Posted August 6, 2015 Hi Kev, I use the Koyo bearing from Revington which has proven to be good and can highly recommend. I can't see anything wrong in your pictures, the wear on the fingers looks normal. Cheers Graeme Thanks Graeme, I'm ordering the Revington bronze carrier & their uprated bearing (they don't mention the manufacturer). So do you think I'm good to go with the existing plate & cover? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Alec Pringle Posted August 6, 2015 Report Share Posted August 6, 2015 What's all the discolouration on the bearing and the diaphragm fingers ? If that is a surfeit of copper grease, which has no business being there, it may be your answer . . . . . ? Cheers Alec Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Kevo_6 Posted August 7, 2015 Author Report Share Posted August 7, 2015 What's all the discolouration on the bearing and the diaphragm fingers ? If that is a surfeit of copper grease, which has no business being there, it may be your answer . . . . . ? Cheers Alec Hi Alec Guilty as charged, but to be fair the clutch was creaky before I did this in May when I took the gearbox out for the second time. I read somewhere to put a bit on the bearing face and the diaphragm fingers had similar wear to this when I looked in May pre copper eaze. I guess I was just desperate to get it working but failed miserably. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Tom Fremont Posted August 7, 2015 Report Share Posted August 7, 2015 Not to gainsay Prof Pringle, but the plates look fine to me whatever discoloration may be present owing to copper grease. TOB grease will find its way out of the bearing anyway, and won't make it to the friction surfaces normally as it is thrown out to the periphery well away from them. IMO the pin in the TOB carrier is there to prevent idle spinning when kissing the PP fingers; such spinning over time can wear away the trunnions and reduce the available stroke. I keep mine in the game, which uses the SACHS pressure plate, LUK driven plate and KOYO bearing - AKA TRF's Magic Clutch Kit. Aligning the gearbox per the now well-known method since the 1900s I've had no need for extra pins, lock wires, Gunst type hydraulic release systems or belts and braces. Cheers, Tom Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Kevo_6 Posted August 7, 2015 Author Report Share Posted August 7, 2015 Not to gainsay Prof Pringle, but the plates look fine to me whatever discoloration may be present owing to copper grease. TOB grease will find its way out of the bearing anyway, and won't make it to the friction surfaces normally as it is thrown out to the periphery well away from them. IMO the pin in the TOB carrier is there to prevent idle spinning when kissing the PP fingers; such spinning over time can wear away the trunnions and reduce the available stroke. I keep mine in the game, which uses the SACHS pressure plate, LUK driven plate and KOYO bearing - AKA TRF's Magic Clutch Kit. Aligning the gearbox per the now well-known method since the 1900s I've had no need for extra pins, lock wires, Gunst type hydraulic release systems or belts and braces. Cheers, Tom Thanks Tom. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RogerH Posted August 9, 2015 Report Share Posted August 9, 2015 Hi Kev, just back from the IWE and have read your words. The better quallity release bearing appears not to have made it to the parts list. You would need to phone the London branch and have a chat. If they haven't a clue ask them to speak to Jeff marks. Roger Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Guest ntc Posted August 9, 2015 Report Share Posted August 9, 2015 Hi Alec Guilty as charged, but to be fair the clutch was creaky before I did this in May when I took the gearbox out for the second time. I read somewhere to put a bit on the bearing face and the diaphragm fingers had similar wear to this when I looked in May pre copper eaze. I guess I was just desperate to get it working but failed miserably. Kevo There is nowt wrong, check the fork pins roll as they should. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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