Bendirk Posted November 2, 2014 Report Share Posted November 2, 2014 My name is Ben de Groot from the Netherlands and I am a very happy TR6 PI CP owner for many years. But I now have a problem I cannot solve. As a frequent reader I have tried to find an answer on the forum to my problem. But I did not succeed. So here comes my first question. I want to replace all high pressure rubber hoses by PTFE tubes By doing this I hope the petrol smell in the back of my TR will disappear. My problem is that I cannot find the right thread sizes of the connections in my PI. E.G Bosch pump (Found = mm) to the pressure relief valve. (Diaphragm Type from Prestige) The threads to and from the Bosch filters (mm) are know by me. The hose connections I want to use for the Teflon lines have AN (3,4,5,6) sizes. Do I need adapters from BSP or UNF or MM to AN sizes. I ‘am lost !!! Thanks in advance for your advice Ben de Groot Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Peter Cobbold Posted November 2, 2014 Report Share Posted November 2, 2014 (edited) Hi Ben, Welcome to the forum. Teflon-lined hoses might solve the smell if fuel vapours are coming through the wall of the hoses. But check the fuel filter: if its the original there are reports of the alloy base becoming porous. Fuel fittings are a nightmare, there are so many different types. I would not risk experimenting on the high pressure side of the pump. Best to enquire of Malcolm at Prestige what fitting he uses on the PRV, and someone on here will I hope advise on the Bosch pump outlet. http://www.prestigeinjection.net/ For the low pressure hoses I would use simple 'hose tails' with proper hose clamps, and simple hose with no stainless braiding. Peter Edited November 2, 2014 by Peter Cobbold Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bendirk Posted November 4, 2014 Author Report Share Posted November 4, 2014 Hi Peter, Thanks for your advice.I have already replaced the filter by a Bosch filter and perhaps the is an expert on the forum who can explain fuel fittings. Greetings from Ben Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RogerH Posted November 4, 2014 Report Share Posted November 4, 2014 Hi Ben, I'm not sure of these people are any good but it looks useful. http://www.thinkauto.com/acatalog/Hose-accessories.html Roger Quote Link to post Share on other sites
peejay4A Posted November 4, 2014 Report Share Posted November 4, 2014 They're the Mocal guys I think so they should be OK. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RogerH Posted November 4, 2014 Report Share Posted November 4, 2014 Hi Pete, they certainly do Mocal along with some other scrumptious stuff. Roger Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Peter Cobbold Posted November 4, 2014 Report Share Posted November 4, 2014 Ben Disappointing there's no definitive advice to help you find the exact fitting from all the possibilities. I suspect that most PI owners fit ready-made hoses complete with fittings as part of a kit including pump and PRV. So they dont need to know the exact fittings specification. Since the PRV came from Prestige it is quite possible he supplied the Bosch pump and hose too, as a kit. Peter Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RobinTR6 Posted November 4, 2014 Report Share Posted November 4, 2014 Got all my hoses braided etc with fittings pump, filter and PRV made by Think automotive. Used them on a Bosch setup as well, can be commended , they know their stuff and made all my pipes while I waited. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
snowric Posted November 4, 2014 Report Share Posted November 4, 2014 PM sent, i made my own and can point you to some suppliers if you want to do the same. it was fun i only filled my boot with petrol once but i bet robin's was easier route ! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
triumph69 Posted November 5, 2014 Report Share Posted November 5, 2014 Hi Ben - try going around all your petrol pipe joints in the boot with a paper tissue - including all the pump and filter inlet /outlet joints - you might have a very small weep of petrol from just one joint causing the smell - this may show up as a small stain on the tissue (or try sniffing it!) it may be too small to drip because it evaporates, but can cause the smell - I have had this problem for over a year after purchasing a "bespoke" Lucas replacement kit from a well known supplier. I have sent it back (twice) with exactly the same problem returning each time. I have now decided to stop wasting my time with this supplier, strip the kit myself, and apply Loctite 577 with the hope that it seals the joints between the pump and the filter. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
stuart Posted November 6, 2014 Report Share Posted November 6, 2014 To find minuscule petrol leaks dust the pipework/joints etc with talcum powder, this will show it up very easily. Stuart. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Prefect Posted November 7, 2014 Report Share Posted November 7, 2014 Check the drain plug tightness. How do I know Quote Link to post Share on other sites
dkbuck Posted November 16, 2014 Report Share Posted November 16, 2014 I had the petrol smell in the boot but there no obvious leaks.Found that the petrol was leaking slowly from the the fuel gauge sender unit down the rear of the tank. By tilting the tank forward it is easy to inspect.Solved,new sender unit gasket.!!! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bendirk Posted December 28, 2014 Author Report Share Posted December 28, 2014 Many thanks to all of you. Useful tips how to find leaking petrol. I have something to do and to smell this winter Greetings from Ben Quote Link to post Share on other sites
astontr6 Posted December 28, 2014 Report Share Posted December 28, 2014 Dear Ben de Groot, TR6 fuel pipe fittings as found on my CR type Metering Unit--- BSP Metering Unit to Fuel Supply Pipe (High Pressure)--- BSP Lucas Pump to original Pressure Relief Type (High Pressure)--- BSP, other unions on unit are also--- BSP PRV Diaphragm Type from Prestige, do not know! As already suggested speak to Prestige. Bosch Pump--- Metric Fuel tank fuel supply union to pump--- UNF Fuel injection pipes from MV to injectors all--- BSP Note: Whitworth spanners are required for BSP If you are going to use PTFE hoses, do not use smooth bore tube for the HP Pump to PRV, only use convoluted tubing PTFE. Other wise you will probably get the dreaded harmonic noise. The only other type of hose that can deal with E10 fuel is: SAE spec.J30 R9 for fuel injection hose. A European manufacture is Codan in Denmark, their spec 3133 refers. Bruce. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bendirk Posted December 31, 2014 Author Report Share Posted December 31, 2014 Dear Ben de Groot, TR6 fuel pipe fittings as found on my CR type Metering Unit--- BSP Metering Unit to Fuel Supply Pipe (High Pressure)--- BSP Lucas Pump to original Pressure Relief Type (High Pressure)--- BSP, other unions on unit are also--- BSP PRV Diaphragm Type from Prestige, do not know! As already suggested speak to Prestige. Bosch Pump--- Metric Fuel tank fuel supply union to pump--- UNF Fuel injection pipes from MV to injectors all--- BSP Note: Whitworth spanners are required for BSP If you are going to use PTFE hoses, do not use smooth bore tube for the HP Pump to PRV, only use convoluted tubing PTFE. Other wise you will probably get the dreaded harmonic noise. The only other type of hose that can deal with E10 fuel is: SAE spec.J30 R9 for fuel injection hose. A European manufacture is Codan in Denmark, their spec 3133 refers. Bruce. Hello Bruce Many thanks for your useful answer.I have many challenges this winter. Greetings Ben Quote Link to post Share on other sites
snowric Posted January 1, 2015 Report Share Posted January 1, 2015 Ben, here is the list in order for my set up. Tank exit 1/2" UNF 20 to AN-6 with copper crush washer an-6 male to female 90 degree adapter an-6 pipe cut to suit sytec high flow filet with an-6 adapters at each end. beware mine needed ptfe tape to work as this sytec filter had tapered thread. then another an-6 pipe to suit my fuel pump is a sytec boshc 979 replacement. Thread sizez are inlet 14x 1.5mm and outlet 12 x 1.5 mm. So you need an-6 adapters for each end with a copper crush washer. then you need to turn the fuel flow 180 degrees. So you can use two 90 degree male female an-6 adapters and then a 120 degree an-6 femal female adapter. then you are into the filter. Mine has analogous sized entrya nd exit. But the final piece you need is a 3/8" bsp to 12 x 1.5mm adapter as the former is the thread size of the t-piece for the prv. I have tired three different set ups so far including a swirl pot with a feeder pump. Current one is simplest and looks like the presitge set up (ie with a really good high flow pre filter and biggest outlet possible). I have also plumbed in a fuel tap, some conserns here that these can leak. Having done all this I still have some noise, whcih seems to reflect the fact that if you use stanless steel hose plus an-6 hard pipe everywhere the pump noise transmits easilt into the fuel tank. SO I am now re-trying with aeroquip hose route with an-8 push on fittings. The hose can be squashed to enable All mounted on a metal plate with rubber mounts to boot well wall. You can use an-6 tube 1/4 or 5/15" adapters to conenct an-6 pipes for the returns to the tank removing yet more rubber. I used the revington teflon hose from the final filter to the PRV t-piece and a newer PRV (Prestige and Revington both sell) to remove resonance. Why did I bother - fuel smell, concerns on ethanol and black dirt in my PRV. All this was fun but as I said expensive; needs caution as one of your unions will leak first time. So you have petrol pooling next to fuel pump connections as you try and nip them up. I wish I had just bought the Prestige kit for £300 as I thnk this will get rid of most of your smell and work ! Once I find out how to post photos I will send one of the swirl tank set up I built and have since replaced (put in new tank with swirl pot and set up was noisy at start up and needed filters changing regularly) Final thought a couple of my fittings would not seal properly so i used some stuff called Gasoila whcih is a nice blue colour, seals the threads and is ethanol proof. Good luck Best SNowy Quote Link to post Share on other sites
snowric Posted January 1, 2015 Report Share Posted January 1, 2015 http://s1383.photobucket.com/user/snowy999/media/photo1_zps7996de3c.jpg.html Here it is. Snowy Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bendirk Posted January 1, 2015 Author Report Share Posted January 1, 2015 Hello Snowy, Many thanks for your extended answer and the picture.You gave me some new ideas about plumbing the PI fuel system. I bought a new SS fuel tank and that is a good opportunity to also rearrange the old piping. Greetings Ben de Groot Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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