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Fitting a saloon OD box to a TR3A


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post-8563-0-65371900-1352845651_thumb.jpgHi

 

After the long 8 year rebuild I'm now on a winter project to fit a Triumph 2000 A type OD box to my 1959 TR3A

 

Another forumite suggested getting hold of a TR4A flywheel and fitting an appropriate diaphragm clutch cover with a 2000 type plate as that would suit the box.

 

I have got a hold of a Tr4 flywheel which I think I can get machined to suit a diaphragm cover. I may get this lightened at the same time.

 

Can anyone tell me if a TR4A/TR5/TR6/GT6 clutch cover will do? but operating on a Triumph 2000/2500 plate , due to the difference in the splined shaft dia. and matching splines on the plate. Covers and plates not at all dear on Ebay, even NOS.

 

Once I have resolved this aspect of the transmission I believe I need to modify the solenoid mounting and rear mounting as well, but those bits can be got from a famous TR supplier, at a price. May have changes to do to the propshaft flange as well.

 

I plan to keep my original flywheel, clutch assy and non OD gearbox as a whole spare transmission set.

 

The Saloon OD gearbox was reputedly an overhauled one with only 4000 miles since overhaul. I can get this tested locally before installing as I have a contact with a test rig.

 

This wise person has said that instead I should merge my manual box with the A type OD via a specialist and also try to find a suitable rear casting for the OD which would simplify the rear mounting. This sounds a pretty dear route and makes me think should I just have laid out the £900 to buy a complete TR OD that would fit. If I actually had £900 left after the rebuild I might have chosen this road ! You know the feeling!

 

Any spare brain waves appreciated.

 

Bill G @ NB

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Edited by billg
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Hi Bill, i used an A Type box from a TR6, got it from TR Bitz. They also sent the casting for the solinoid so it stands up instead of laying down. The only thing i needed to change was the rear mount, it needed the holes lengthend because the whole setup was about a 1/2 inch longer than the non O.D box. Apart from the fact that several internal parts had been ratted from theO.D it all went straight in and works a treat. I hope you get it sorted soon

Graham

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I'd also appreciate any info on installing an OD box into a TR3A from anyone who can help - I'm just starting my restoration, so I'd like to read up on any alternatives available. (And particularly to learn about "blind alleys"! )

 

Other forum users have suggested so far (thanks, folks)

 

http://www.tr-register.com.au/Files/technical/2500gearbox.htm

 

and a suggestion to talk with Peter Cox, but I'm not sure how best to do that......

 

Like Bill, I'm sure that there must be folks a'plenty on here who've got the info on this and can save us re-inventing wheels here!

 

Look forward to hearing what you've fitted and what the difficulties were....

 

Cheers,

John

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Hi John, like you I have a TR3A and am looking to modify a Triumph 2000 box which has an A-Type OD. The article you posted was for a J Type box. I will contact Peter Cox as suggested and have a coupleof other avenues toexplore as well. The flywheel was due to arrive today.

 

Plus I need to get my OD box onto the test rig next week to see if it's as good as PO made out before I paid the money.

 

Bill G @ NB

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Hi Bill,

I'd certainly appreciate you passing on anything you think I'd find helpful. Yes, I forgot the article was about a J-type box - senior moment!

 

As someone new to TR's, I'm trying to read up on the differences/useability of various gearboxes like Stag, TR6, 2000,2500, 1850Sprint, etc etc as well as modifying my current 'box - as I'm sure plenty of people must have been down these routes before and already have the answers - it's just finding somewhere it's written down! ( in the Daimler Owners Club, we have an indexed compilation of all the articles written over the years about the SP250, and it's available in photocopied book form, covering R&P conversions, brake conversions, OD conversions, etcetc. When I'm at the NEC over the weekend and join the Register, I'm hoping to find out whether a similar source exists for TR's)

 

Hope the 'box turns out well on the rig......

Cheers, John

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Hi John

The TR register forum pages are all archived and searchable, plus there is a Technicalities CD which you can getfrom the Club Office.

 

 

The trouble with the OD mod, especially using a saloon box , are all the variations on donor car, type of OD, a or J, plus various rear housing/mounting permutations. Plus clutch cover, splie and thrust bearing options and matching flywheels .

 

You need some persistence for this lark!!!

 

The costs are not inconsiderable either, but anyone who does have overdrive loves it and as I hope to do long journeys , it's the way to go.

 

Just hope That changing a major component that already works well is not too dopey!

 

Bill G @ NB

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If you search the forum you will find the various posts that I have put up regarding my saloon overdrive.

 

In summary, I obtained a good saloon (T2000) A type gearbox c/w overdrive. The o/d was rebuilt to TR standards by Ovedrive Repair Services and this included replacing the rear casing. The gearbox was generally OK although I changed a couple of bearings for good measure.

 

A good point that has been picked up in this thread is that the later boxes have a thicker flange on the bell housing and are a few mm longer which means that you need to elongate the mounting holes in the rear support bracket to get them to fit.

 

Rgds Ian

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This seems to be a topic often discussed !

 

I´m heading back to England for 2 days next week to collect a large amount of spares for my 2.5Pi restoration. These include 2 complete gearboxes from Triumph 2000´s, both of which have A-type overdrive units.

 

I have been reading lots on the forum here and all across the interweb trying to gather information on converting a TR3a to 2000 gearbox with overdrive as I may use 1 of the aforementioned gearboxes to attempt this. There´s plenty of useful information but it takes a bit of wading through !

 

Has anyone managed to put together a definitive specification for a clutch system used when doing this conversion ?

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Hi Folks, I think my clutch options will be based round saloon/GT6 clutch components. I have found a Quinton Hazel NOS GT6 3 piece kit with cover, plate ( with 6 springs) and thrust bearing, which will fit the fork on the existing cross shaft in the gearbox housing.I will see how well this fits on the modified TR4 flywheel and report back.Now wondering where I can get the solenoid mounting casting to make the solenoid vertical? Any suggestions, or just the mossy option?also will have to decide about getting a bracket for the rear gearbox mounting. Anyone got a drawing or a good supplier?I promise to post pics of the bits as I travel down this long and winding road.Hope this inspires other to OD!Bill G @NB

 

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Edited by billg
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Has anyone managed to put together a definitive specification for a clutch system used when doing this conversion ?

 

 

The saloon box has a smaller diameter input shaft than the TR. The saloon driven plate is 1/2 inch smaller in dia than the TR item. I am not planning to go rally driving or doing racing starts so I have used a NOS saloon driven plate with the original TR pressure plate assembly.

 

If this doesn't work, I understand that there is an Isuzu driven plate that is the same dia as the TR item but has the correct diameter and number of splines.

 

Rgds Ian

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Hi Folks,

 

Life is never ever simple.

 

The TR3A/4 flywheel I ordered from the Ebayer arrived but is a TR2/3 type as it has a shrunk on ring!!! Drat !!!

 

Despite the fact that his photo on Ebay shows a flywheel with bolts holding on the ring gear !!

 

The supplier says he has 40 flywheels and he must have pick up the wrong one! HE was very gracious about this and says he will try to sort it out.

 

As you know its a 4A flywheel that I'd really prefer, but I can live with a 3A/4 one.

 

The supplier says he will dig into the pile of flywheels, if I can supply a photo of a TR4A flywheel ideally from the clutch cover side showing

the dowel pin locations and the hold down bolts for the clutch cover.

 

Has any kind soul got such a picture they could post on this thread fairly soon? or does the Parts book for a TR4A have a good drawing or image of that side of the flywheel.

 

A good idea would be to show all three (at least) different TR2/3 TR3A/4 and TR4A flywheels side by side for the general education of the sidescreen community. Many of us only have ever had one TR at a time but we all know there are older folks who have barns!

 

As I said a long and winding road.

 

At least its not preventing me from using the car, if only they would stop salt spreading which has been happening this week.

 

Happy motoring from Bill G @ NB

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I´ll have a look in the parts store and parts books at work tomorrow lunchtime Bill, see if I can find one to photograph or scan.

 

Is this the best flywheel to use for the conversion then ?

 

Martin.

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Hi Martin,

 

A Saloon box uses a diaphragm clutch cover & plate e.g. I've opted for a 2000/GT6 as it has the smaller dia spline as already highlighted. TR's have alarger dia splined input shaft.

 

I was told that the TR4A flywheel can accept a diaphragm clutch cover from a 2000 or a GT6. Alternatively a Tr3A/4 flywheel can be drilled to accept a 2000 or GT6 cover.

 

You may be able to use a TR cover (but using a saloon plate)( with three levers) and a matching thrust bearing/carrier but that is not the route I'm going down.

 

No doubt I'll bump into other problems on the way! The new clutch cover should be with me by the weekend. Hope I can sort out the flywheel issues soon before starting on the other bits of the problem.

 

Regards

 

Bill G @ NB

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Hi Bill & Co.

 

Thanks for the flywheel and clutch combination info. I´ll have to do some experimenting myself and see what combination works best for me over here with what´s available.

 

I had a rummage in the parts store this afternoon and turned up this flywheel, marked TR3-4. I hope they are the pictures you require !

 

DSCF2694.jpg

 

DSCF2693.jpg

 

Regards,

 

Martin.

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  • 8 months later...

On the long and winding OD conversion road again!

 

I finally picked up a TR4A at Malvern and also a new rear AType housing plus solenoid plate.

 

I drove down to Malvern from near Edinburgh and completed 770 miles in total over the weekend!

 

If previous OD hopefuls have made progress in the last year please rejoin this link. Now researching ratios and the details of the OD box.

 

I believe most TR3's had a 3.7 ratio back axle and I can find the ratios of the gearbox fairly easily but the saloon boxmaytake a bit longer.

 

Bill G@NB

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Overdrive Repair Services are excellent to deal with and have all the parts you need if you are converting a saloon box, or rebuilding an original TR box. They have the rear casing castings too. Prices were much better than you know who.

My overdrive is a bit of a hybrid...A series saloon box, O.R.S. bolt on casting to give correct solenoid location, and Vanguard rear overdrive outer casing which gives the correct flat (horizontal) rear mounting points. Good luck finding a Vanguard casing though....purchased mine 30 years ago as a spare. It's all come together well, gives me synchro on low, and o/drive in 3rd and top gear. You can wire it up for 2nd gear as well but not recommended. My TR has just been painted, can't wait to fit everything up and get motoring.

 

cheers

 

Pete

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