Royzeboyze Posted November 18, 2009 Report Share Posted November 18, 2009 Hi folks, I have seen at various shows, cars with tailor made ducting sets made of aluminium, also heat shields. Can someone put me in touch with the firm that makes them. I have seen the various cardboard concoctions. I can't be bothered to make one myself, and the ones I have seen are very professional. Regards Royzeboyze Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Menno van Rij Posted November 18, 2009 Report Share Posted November 18, 2009 An aluminium cooling duct looks beautiful, but a word of warning in advance: Last year, when the restoration of my TR was more or less complete, I also considered an alu. ducting. Only hours before I started looking on the internet, an other 3A was pushed into the workshop. The 3A had some frontal damage after a low speed collision. Although a small accident, the result was, that the car couldn't be driven: the grill pushed back the alu ducting, thus pushing the backside of the ducting through the radiator core... A leaking radiator prevented the car to be driven. That's when I decided to keep the card board ducting!. Again, I think an alu one looks great. But not for me. Menno Quote Link to post Share on other sites
angelfj Posted November 18, 2009 Report Share Posted November 18, 2009 An aluminium cooling duct looks beautiful, but a word of warning in advance: Last year, when the restoration of my TR was more or less complete, I also considered an alu. ducting. Only hours before I started looking on the internet, an other 3A was pushed into the workshop. The 3A had some frontal damage after a low speed collision. Although a small accident, the result was, that the car couldn't be driven: the grill pushed back the alu ducting, thus pushing the backside of the ducting through the radiator core... A leaking radiator prevented the car to be driven. That's when I decided to keep the card board ducting!. Again, I think an alu one looks great. But not for me. Menno Menno: Hello. Trust you are well. I have to admit that I had assumed that ST were so cheap that they only looked for the lowest cost solution to a problem. As we know, the cardboard "shroud" was not included as part of the factory design. Rather, it was a solution to complaints of overheating from owners in the states. I believe it was Don Elliott who told me that he was notified by the dealer that he could come in and have this "shroud" installed at no cost. It seems , in the final analysis, that ST chose an intelligent AND low cost solution to the problem. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
TR3BGeorge Posted November 19, 2009 Report Share Posted November 19, 2009 Looking in my Spare Parts Catalog, the Radiator Air Deflector appeared with TS22014. Back then, it came in 9 colors, with 4 set screws and 4 plain washers. The fiber-board deflector part numbers were 803440 thru 803448. TRF sells the black reflector (803440) for $18.99. Moss (855-125) sells it for $18.65. So, adding in freight to Europe, you can get one for around $4,000.00 !!! I hope this helps. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Ian Vincent Posted November 19, 2009 Report Share Posted November 19, 2009 TR Shop were knocking them out at £10 a pop recently, I bought one to use as a pattern for an aluminium one and was going to look separately at how to avoid it puncturing the rad in a low speed collision. Rgds Ian Quote Link to post Share on other sites
TR 2100 Posted November 19, 2009 Report Share Posted November 19, 2009 Looking in my Spare Parts Catalog, the Radiator Air Deflector appeared with TS22014. Back then, it came in 9 colors, with 4 set screws and 4 plain washers. The fiber-board deflector part numbers were 803440 thru 803448. I think the Parts Book showing the air deflector as being fitted from TS 22014 is a retrospective statement of suitability. There wasn't the same air cooling problem with the earlier cars, as the TR2/3 front apron chanelled the air through the radiator. I think the factory found, quite quickly, that this did not happen with the wider 3A grille, so they started fitting the deflector shield AND offered fitment to early 3As, such as the Don's, that did not have them fitted from new. 9 colours? Really? Not arguing, as you quote part numbers and I don't have my Parts Book to hand, but I can't see what the 9 colours would be. I had a new red one, never fitted, that I think went to the SDF. The factory air deflector for the 3A was fairly flat - I can't see an ally copy causing any problems by being pushed through the radiator. Maybe it is a different design. If the 3A aftermarket design follows the TR4 style, then yes, it could be pushed through the radiator. AlanR Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BrianC Posted November 19, 2009 Report Share Posted November 19, 2009 9 colours? Really? Not arguing, as you quote part numbers and I don't have my Parts Book to hand, but I can't see what the 9 colours would be. 803440 Black 803441 Signal Red 803442 Pearl White 803443 Green 803444 Powder Blue 803445 Pearl Grey 803446 Silverstone Grey 803447 Sebring White 803448 Pale Yellow And I wonder how many of each they sold! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
stuart Posted November 19, 2009 Report Share Posted November 19, 2009 The idea of body colour was so you couldnt see it when fitted. ( Another thing for the concours boys to worry about ) Stuart. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
jean Posted November 19, 2009 Report Share Posted November 19, 2009 Menno, I fully agree with you, but I think the airducts were not the only reason for the puncture. In case of a collision of moderate magnitude the flat part of the apron with the crank bracket will probably cut the radiator in 2 parts with or without alu deflector. The deflectors should anyhow stay well clear of the mesh. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
M. Pied Lourd Posted November 19, 2009 Report Share Posted November 19, 2009 Royze, You mentioned "heat shields" in your post. Not sure if you are referring to the carb heats shields, but there is a company in the US that makes them out of Stainless Steel. Alexander Racing Enterprises http://www.the-vintage-racer.com/webroot/Heatshields/ $44.50 US Cheers, M. Pied Lourd Quote Link to post Share on other sites
TR3BGeorge Posted November 19, 2009 Report Share Posted November 19, 2009 Hello Royze, I have a friend whose company makes the heat shield that Moss sells, and have talked with him about them. If you are in a very hot climate, they are a godsend. He cured 3 cases of vapor lock with the shields. And they improve the appearance of the engine by covering up that ungodly looking rusty exhaust manifold. The downside: it makes the starter motor impossible to get to, so you have to remove it (4 or 8 bolts, depending on the engine) to get to the starter. I hope this helps. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Menno van Rij Posted November 20, 2009 Report Share Posted November 20, 2009 heat shield? Here's the one on my car. Menno Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BrianC Posted November 20, 2009 Report Share Posted November 20, 2009 That's a very impressive shield Menno and the neatest I've seen. However, I can't help wondering whether heat shields have an adverse effect on the cooling of the engine by trapping the exhaust heat. Maybe they cure one problem, but introduce another? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Mychael Posted November 20, 2009 Report Share Posted November 20, 2009 That's a very impressive shield Menno and the neatest I've seen. However, I can't help wondering whether heat shields have an adverse effect on the cooling of the engine by trapping the exhaust heat. Maybe they cure one problem, but introduce another? Looks bit like a Roadster factory shield, very neat although from the photo it looks as if the front fuel bowl is not protected. You could always wrap the exhaust manifold in heat tape as well I suppose. Mychael Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Menno van Rij Posted November 20, 2009 Report Share Posted November 20, 2009 (edited) yep, it's the Roadster Factory's shield. It was given free of charge after buying lots of parts from them. Not visible here: the front bowl is protected. I did consider wrapping the exhaust, bu then I talked to a guy from the vintage cars racing scene. He had taken off the wrapping that was around his exhaust manifold. Inside the wrapping, the manifold had been 'eaten' by corrosion. I hadn't seen that before. but he showed me the manifold: the steel was as thin as paper! I don't have problems cooling the car. The car runs fine, the gauge pointing about halfway on the scale. I even did try the car on a very hot day this summer. I've take)n the car through city traffic that day, trying to see what would happen. The engine (coolant became hot, but not too. The engine never missed a beat, so I think that the carbs are shielded enough. I run the car with a small modern style starter and a Suzuki Swift (MY90) Nippon Denso alternator. These electrical items are so small that the electrical wires do not suffer heat damage from the exhaust manifold. An even smaller alternator can be found on Kubota garden machines with the small diesel engine! These alternators have the size of a man's fist, delivering 35 Amp. Menno Edited November 20, 2009 by Menno van Rij Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Mychael Posted November 21, 2009 Report Share Posted November 21, 2009 I did consider wrapping the exhaust, bu then I talked to a guy from the vintage cars racing scene. He had taken off the wrapping that was around his exhaust manifold. Inside the wrapping, the manifold had been 'eaten' by corrosion. I hadn't seen that before. but he showed me the manifold: the steel was as thin as paper! Yes, I've hear about the corrosion problem, no one has explained to me yet why that should be, I have my extractors coated in that "Jet hot" ceramic stuff, they still however radiate a lot of heat. I run the car with a small modern style starter and a Suzuki Swift (MY90) Nippon Denso alternator. These electrical items are so small that the electrical wires do not suffer heat damage from the exhaust manifold. An even smaller alternator can be found on Kubota garden machines with the small diesel engine! These alternators have the size of a man's fist, delivering 35 Amp. I like the idea of a really small alternator, any extra space you can make in a TR's engine bay has got to be a good thing, I wonder about the longevity though of those alternators that tiny. Mychael Menno Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RandallD Posted November 23, 2009 Report Share Posted November 23, 2009 Just a small comment on the heat shield. The shield is made by Joe Alexander, of Alexander Racing Enterprises. Joe funds his TR4 racing habit by selling a few nice bits for our TRs, on ebay, his website, or a few of the bigger Triumph vendors such as The Roadster Factory. No financial interest myself, other than I can say Joe is a very nice guy who has helped me several times. Regards, Randy Quote Link to post Share on other sites
TR 2100 Posted November 23, 2009 Report Share Posted November 23, 2009 The shield is made by Joe Alexander, Joe is a very nice guy who has helped me several times. Joe is a top guy. He makes quite a few nice bits and pieces, usually developed for his own use but has more made to the same pattern. I have one of his alloy front plates, also his TR4 anti-torque arm, but he also does thin wheel spacers, very nicely machined ram tubes, rocker cover nuts and a few other bits that escape me at the moment. eBay ID n197tr4 - highly recommended. AlanR Quote Link to post Share on other sites
stuart Posted November 23, 2009 Report Share Posted November 23, 2009 Joe is a top guy. He makes quite a few nice bits and pieces, usually developed for his own use but has more made to the same pattern. I have one of his alloy front plates, also his TR4 anti-torque arm, but he also does thin wheel spacers, very nicely machined ram tubes, rocker cover nuts and a few other bits that escape me at the moment. eBay ID n197tr4 - highly recommended. AlanR Alan I couldnt find that user ID anywhere could you double check for me please. Stuart Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Mychael Posted November 24, 2009 Report Share Posted November 24, 2009 Just a small comment on the heat shield. The shield is made by Joe Alexander, of Alexander Racing Enterprises. Joe funds his TR4 racing habit by selling a few nice bits for our TRs, on ebay, his website, or a few of the bigger Triumph vendors such as The Roadster Factory. No financial interest myself, other than I can say Joe is a very nice guy who has helped me several times. Regards, Randy I found their website ok but when I tried to send them an email it kept bouncing. Mychael Quote Link to post Share on other sites
TR 2100 Posted November 24, 2009 Report Share Posted November 24, 2009 (edited) Alan I couldnt find that user ID anywhere could you double check for me please. Stuart Stuart, Sorry - I took his ID from an old email. Joe has now added a few characters at the end : n197tr40qpj Or check this link for his current listings. http://motors.shop.ebay.com/n197tr40qpj/m.html?_nkw=&_armrs=1&_from=&_ipg= AlanR Edited November 24, 2009 by TR 2100 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
stuart Posted November 24, 2009 Report Share Posted November 24, 2009 Stuart, Sorry - I took his ID from an old email. Joe has now added a few characters at the end : n197tr40qpj Or check this link for his current listings. http://motors.shop.ebay.com/n197tr40qpj/m.html?_nkw=&_armrs=1&_from=&_ipg= AlanR Excellent, thanks for that Alan. Stuart Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Royzeboyze Posted November 24, 2009 Author Report Share Posted November 24, 2009 An aluminium cooling duct looks beautiful, but a word of warning in advance: Last year, when the restoration of my TR was more or less complete, I also considered an alu. ducting. Only hours before I started looking on the internet, an other 3A was pushed into the workshop. The 3A had some frontal damage after a low speed collision. Although a small accident, the result was, that the car couldn't be driven: the grill pushed back the alu ducting, thus pushing the backside of the ducting through the radiator core... A leaking radiator prevented the car to be driven. That's when I decided to keep the card board ducting!. Again, I think an alu one looks great. But not for me. Menno Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Royzeboyze Posted November 24, 2009 Author Report Share Posted November 24, 2009 Hi Menno, Lovely heat shield, I bought one for an MGTD and it was lined with a heat resistance substance, years ago we would have used asbestos. This was held to the aluminium by stainless rivets, has yours got a backing about one eighth of an inch to a quarter thick, or is it just plain alloy? It looks as if I will have to make both ducting and a heat shield, if I make the ducting I will cut an appropriate hole for trunking to cool the carbs. Also the heat shield will have the appropriate heat resisting backing. I need to replace the radiator, so I will have one of the up to date cores, a pal of mine has one of those criss cross ones for extra cooling, also doing away with the starting handle hole. I have a pair of carbs and exhaust manifold for a 4A like yours, all ready to go. My petrol pipe will go round the back of the head wrapped in heat resistant material, it seems a long way round the front, with all the other bits and pieces in the way. Hopefully will start work soon. Regards to yourself and all who wrote in. Royzeboyze Quote Link to post Share on other sites
BrianC Posted November 24, 2009 Report Share Posted November 24, 2009 My petrol pipe will go round the back of the head wrapped in heat resistant material, it seems a long way round the front, with all the other bits and pieces in the way. That's a good point - I've often wondered why it goes the long way round. Maybe designed by Ewan McGregor & Charley Boorman? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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