PYU940F Posted February 15, 2018 Report Share Posted February 15, 2018 Progress on the front suspension poly bushes going well. I made the spring compressor with 16mm rod and a thick aluminium plate. It's so solid I reckon it would do the suspension on a Sherman tank. Getting the holes drilled in the correct places for the shock mounting bolts was much more difficult than I had imagined as the angle of dangle between top and bottom makes the need to make the holes much larger than one would think. Poly bushes are in the upper wishbones on drivers side but I now notice they are different. I cannot see the passenger side ones to compare as car is tight against the garage wall. I cannot find any part numbers stamped on them. I think the more "curvy" one is the front. Am I correct? I could not get all of the split pin out one of the castellated nuts on the upper fulcrum pin. I can either take the fulcrum pin off and drill out the stump of the split pin or put a nyloc on instead. Taking the fulcrum pin out with the inner wing in place looks a bit of a mission so hoping opinion is OK for the nyloc. I have bought the uprated lower fulcrum attach brackets with double studs. I guess the second hole in the chassis has to be drilled. To retain correct geometry the accuracy of the hole has to be pretty good. Any tricks to get the hole in the correct place without undue fettlement? Thanks to those who have done this job. Cheers Simon Quote Link to post Share on other sites
rcreweread Posted February 15, 2018 Report Share Posted February 15, 2018 Simon Does this photo help - I keep the original on my garage wall so I can't forget - it's a photo from an earlier post which I cant find but it will give you the correct orientation Cheers Rich Quote Link to post Share on other sites
openroad Posted February 15, 2018 Report Share Posted February 15, 2018 Yes definitely the more Cranked one on the right on the drivers side and on the left on the passenger side. Cheers Conrad. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
rcreweread Posted February 15, 2018 Report Share Posted February 15, 2018 (edited) Simon I meant to say about your suspension mountings, use your new brackets to make a template and then drill the mounting accordingly - so long as you don't disturb the original top hole and make any adjustments ( if you have to ) to the new bottom hole, you shouldn't disturb the suspension geometry - also try and make a rectangular washer out of reasonable thickness steel plate with the same hole spacings to fit the other side of the mounting under the nuts. If you could make the spring compressor, I'm sure you could do all this Cheers Rich Edited February 16, 2018 by rcreweread Quote Link to post Share on other sites
PYU940F Posted February 16, 2018 Author Report Share Posted February 16, 2018 (edited) Thanks all. I will make a wooden template for the bracket, do not know why I did not think of that. As far as nyloc nuts or the suspension is concerned, I have found the answer. Bottom of page 74 in Moss Catalogue it gives the nyloc equivalent part no.s for the suspension slotted nuts saying that the reason they were not fitted at build was simply because it was not common practice at the time. That is going to save me a lot of hassle. I also found out from a U tube video that the front upper wishbone arms are stamped R and L on the top surface. Cleaned it off and the markings were there! Cheers Simon Edited February 16, 2018 by PYU940F Quote Link to post Share on other sites
stuart Posted February 16, 2018 Report Share Posted February 16, 2018 Visual of the new hole for the two bolt fixing. Stuart. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
PYU940F Posted February 16, 2018 Author Report Share Posted February 16, 2018 Hi Any tricks of the trade to get the old nylon bushes out of the outer lower wishbones? They are resisting hard. Cheers] Simon Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RogerH Posted February 16, 2018 Report Share Posted February 16, 2018 Hi Simon, have you got the big bolt out? If yes, have you got the steel tube out from the nylon bushes? If - yes then the bushes should simply knock out with a punch etc. Roger Quote Link to post Share on other sites
PYU940F Posted February 17, 2018 Author Report Share Posted February 17, 2018 Hi I have got one lower wishbone off the bolt at the nut end and this nylon bush will not come out. I have tried knocking it out with absolutely no effect. I have also tried using a bolt and washers and socket etc. I tightened the nut with a bar until I thought the bolt was about to snap. I have done this suspension overhaul by keeping the hub in place, so at the moment the vertical link and trunnion are still in place with the forward wishbone still attached and the trunnion bolt will not shift. I thought this was a smart way of doing it. I did the upper wishbones first, removing them by undoing the two bolts that attach them to the ball joint, put the poly bushes in and reattached them and then jammed a piece of wood between the turret and upper wishbones to support the hub. I am soaking the trunnion and bolt with WD40 overnight so hopefully that may shift tomorrow. I will probably buy just the right size circular saw drill and drill out the nylon bush a mm or so away from the bush. If I cannot get the bolt out then I will have to take the hub off and wrestle with it in the workshop. Problem I have is the car is in a remote garage with no power some distance away from my workshop t home so I am trying to do as much as possible in the garage. If the trunnion bolt is so seized in the trunnion it may be prudent to replace the trunnion anyway then I can forget about removing the bolt. Come to think of it a couple of new lower wishbone would solve my bush problem. Any one know why in the Moss catalogue one lower wishbone is £25 and the other £73?? Weird. Simon Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RogerH Posted February 17, 2018 Report Share Posted February 17, 2018 Hi Simon, the nylon bush is simply 'rusted' in place. Remove the hub etc and do the work at home. Using a big pin punch attach the nylon bush half way down inside the bore. Again the bolt has rusted onto the steel tubes. The problem here is that when you whack it with a hammer etc the impact is taken up by the surrounding softer bushes. You may need to drill the head off the bolt and then drill through the bolt until it all falls to bits. TRy to save the trunnion. Pour the WD40 down the drain. It is not a penetrating fluid - PlusGas etc are the decent fluids. However they may also not work. Roger Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Lebro Posted February 17, 2018 Report Share Posted February 17, 2018 Pour the WD40 down the drain Roger shocked ! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
PYU940F Posted February 17, 2018 Author Report Share Posted February 17, 2018 Thanks Roger, I will wrestle with it. The forward wishbone is free on the bolt so it is only seized inside the trunnion. Leaving the hub on perhaps was not so smart, but all a learning curve. At least with the hub off I can re-grease the bearings. Cheers Simon Quote Link to post Share on other sites
stuart Posted February 17, 2018 Report Share Posted February 17, 2018 (edited) I normally build or strip the front suspension as a complete unit off the car as it makes life so much easier, 4 bolts on top to remove top inner bracket, 4 nuts off lower inner chassis brackets, track rod end split and brake pipe removed.Then its easy to get everything stripped/rebuilt on the bench. Dont forget to take note of number of shims on the lower inner to chassis brackets. Stuart. Edited February 17, 2018 by stuart Quote Link to post Share on other sites
stuart Posted February 17, 2018 Report Share Posted February 17, 2018 Oh and for reference do have a good look at the lower inner brackets and the bolts that go through them holding the wishbones in and also the condition of the thread on the upright and the condition of the trunnion. Pictures below came from a car supposedly not long restored. Stuart. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
PYU940F Posted February 17, 2018 Author Report Share Posted February 17, 2018 You are dead right Stuart that is the way I will do the other side. I have the trunnion and forward wishbone in the workshop (AKA the garden shed) to get this wretched bolt out. As Roger suggested I will save the trunnion even if it kills me. It is a genuine Stanpart and is in really good condition, as is the vertical link. I seem to remember changing both soon after I bought the car, so '75 or '76. Also recall that a job like this was a Sunday morning affair to be done between a late breakfast and last orders at 2pm down the pub. I have no idea what has changed between then and now? Would a modicum of heat help on the trunnion? I have no idea of the properties of bronze. I would hate to damage or weaken it. Have a fear it is going to be a grind the head off, cut the end of the bolt off and drill down the length of the bolt jobby. Deep joy, that's going to be £25 in drill bits for sure. Cheers Simon Quote Link to post Share on other sites
peter clarke Posted February 18, 2018 Report Share Posted February 18, 2018 Check the clearance between the inside of the wheel rim and the ends of the top arms and outer nut and bolt securing the top suspension joint when steering is at full lock.. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RogerH Posted February 18, 2018 Report Share Posted February 18, 2018 shocked ! Why! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Hamish Posted February 18, 2018 Report Share Posted February 18, 2018 Why! My guess pollution. Oil in the drains ☠️ Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RogerH Posted February 18, 2018 Report Share Posted February 18, 2018 My guess pollution. Oil in the drains ☠️ It is proclaimed as a jack of all trades - and it truly is a master of none. It can give that instant fix to unwind a rusty nut. But it is not a penetrating oil or anything else. Roger Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Hamish Posted February 18, 2018 Report Share Posted February 18, 2018 It is proclaimed as a jack of all trades - and it truly is a master of none. It can give that instant fix to unwind a rusty nut. But it is not a penetrating oil or anything else. Roger Very true. And I bet we all have a can on the shelf. And a trick use. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
littlejim Posted February 18, 2018 Report Share Posted February 18, 2018 (edited) Thanks all. I will make a wooden template for the bracket, do not know why I did not think of that. As far as nyloc nuts or the suspension is concerned, I have found the answer. Bottom of page 74 in Moss Catalogue it gives the nyloc equivalent part no.s for the suspension slotted nuts saying that the reason they were not fitted at build was simply because it was not common practice at the time. That is going to save me a lot of hassle. I also found out from a U tube video that the front upper wishbone arms are stamped R and L on the top surface. Cleaned it off and the markings were there! Cheers Simon Don't forget the re-enforcing kits that Moss and others do strengthen where the mounts join the chassis. Guess they based them on bits that failed under years of load. Edited February 18, 2018 by littlejim Quote Link to post Share on other sites
PYU940F Posted February 18, 2018 Author Report Share Posted February 18, 2018 SUCCESS Result 1 I soaked the offending trunnion with seized bolt in it (with one wishbone still attached) in a bowl of plus gas overnight. In the vice, 13/16 impact socket on the nut and 24 inch breaker bar. Nothing, zilch, zippo apart from just about wrenching the vice off the workbench. I then googled about the coefficient of expansion of phosphor bronze versus top grade steel and found the bronze did expand more. I was not keen about heating the trunnion with a blow torch for fear of deformation or localised crystallised weakening so I put the piece of beef that Caroline had put into the Le Creuset roasting dish to one side and bunged the trunnion into it and into the oven at gas mark 7 for 45 minutes. Then back in the vice. Et voila out it came. The fact that the beef will have a small tinge of plus gas is a very small rice to pay. (for me anyway) Result 2 I still had a couple of nylon bushes and the metal tubes well stuck. I had just burned out the rubber bushes from the other end so I wondered if nylon burns well. It does and I think the vapour it gives off is cyanide gas but it worked brilliantly. I hope these tips will help others, when I come to do the other side it will be a cinch. Cheers Simon Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RogerH Posted February 18, 2018 Report Share Posted February 18, 2018 Hi Simon, good result. Regards burning nylon. Make sure you have the right stuff. DO NOT let molten Viton (similar to black nylon in looks) touch your skin. It will eat you away until you only have your toe nails left. Honest. Roger Quote Link to post Share on other sites
PYU940F Posted February 18, 2018 Author Report Share Posted February 18, 2018 "It will eat you away until you only have your toe nails left. Honest" Thanks for letting me know now, I was wondering why I had lost so much weight. BTW the trunnion was worth saving as it looks pristine inside. On another matter. How many turns (or 1/2 turns easier to count) should the vertical link be wound back from fully tight in the trunnion? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Lebro Posted February 18, 2018 Report Share Posted February 18, 2018 As few as possible while allowing full steering movement. Bob. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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