Classic Le Mans 2016 Sponsorship

[Paul Hogan]

Hello folks.

 

I know next years CLM is a long way off but I have been asked if I could put a 3 car TR team together with a view to competing there again. I have made some preliminary enquiries and it seems we would be welcomed back there as we put on a good show last year. However, here is the rub, its horrendously expensive to enter and last year we enjoyed the financial support of Penrite Oil.

 

There have been some management changes at Penrite and so its unlikely that they will be in a position to support us next year so what I'm asking for is for some help in just defraying the costs of entry which is likely to be in the region of £ 8.000 + based on last years entry figures.

 

Any ideas as to where or how this sort of money could be raised would be most welcome.

 

Hogie

 

ps This post has also been posted on the members only section

[kevin bryant]

Paul

 

Paul

 

For one, I would love to see the TR Team back at CLM, perhaps backed by a bit of advertorial in the likes of Octane or Classic and Sportscar prior to the event.

 

I guess the traditional sponsors would be from those companies which sell regular replacement items, ie oil or tyre companies eg Vredestein. Or perhaps one of the waterless coolant brands eg Evans

 

Then there's the financial side, ie finance or insurance companies eg the TR Register Insurance Company

 

Or the more modern crowd funding. eg how many TR Register members would be willing to throw in a tenner trough paypal or similar?

 

But I have to say the most obvious would be that organisation which promises to represent all TR owners past, present and future. I understand it has a few grand lying around in its bank accounts.

 

Best wishes Kev

[john.r.davies]

Formula One, and other high-end motor sport series have "pay-drivers", while at the bottom end, in club motorsport, it's the driver that pays for everything, and does all the preparation work too. So what about "pay-pitcrew"? Competent, race-experienced Triumpheros, who will contribute to the costs of entry, in exchange for the priviledge of being there, and playing a part in this iconic event?

 

The rate of contribution would be negotiable, but let's say a crew of four in the pit garage while the car is on track for the three sessions of the event and the immediate pre and post session maintenance/repairs . That makes twelve sessions. Those who wish to take part could 'buy' just one or three each. No doubt the owners and drivers (if they are not the same) will make a major contribution, so if the pit crew were to pay half the cost, then 'shares' at about £300 each?

 

Other fundraising ideas - small sponsor squares? Buy a square inch of the cars's bodywork, to bear your own initials, your loved one's or even your business (tax deductable, of course!) IF the event regulations allow, of course.

 

John

[Alec Pringle]

Hi John,

 

The priority in the pits is folks who are competent and able to work together as a team - and bear in mind that the pit personnel are strictly limited in number, not mob-handed.

 

It's an expensive exercise assisting - there aren't many entry tickets doled out, so you finish up buying your own at £100 apiece or whatever. You'll be driving down Wednesday, back Monday, so that's 6 days in time cost. Then there's the small question of mileage, in our case 1000 miles round trip, and I reckon it costs 35p/mile so that's £350. Another £150 for the ferry. So for the V8 Lady and I that's £700 for starters. All in, probably £1000 for the weekend.

 

Crew don't see that much of the weekend's racing, there isn't that much time to spare if you're doing a half-decent job - you're there to work, not play.

 

Anyone who expects the crew to pay a premium of a few hundred quid on top of that has to be having a laugh.

 

As for sponsorship from the TR Register itself . . . . . that is realistic only if the whole exercise is conducted as a TR Register project, properly managed by the club and with an adequate budget to generate the appropriate PR and media coverage. That suggests that a £5K direct sponsorship, for example, might require another £15K allocation to actually make the weekend worthwhile.

 

Meanwhile the plans for such an exercise in 12 months time should by now already be done and dusted, along with all the planning for a major TRR spectator presence at the event. Planning for the next Classic Le Mans project starts with post-race debriefing back at base, and should have been completed by 12 month mid-point, ie about now.

 

If that is not the case, there is no point in even thinking about sponsoring a car, that would be no more than indulging someone else's jolly . . . . .

 

Cheers

 

Alec

[Paul Hogan]

Thanks guys for the feed back from here, elsewhere and from those who pm'd me. There are some good points raised and Alec is right in that as pit crew you don't get the passes and its certainly not a jolly as pit crew have to work bloody hard to make sure the cars is prepared on time.

 

While our three car entry last year split over three grids was very good for our spectators, logistically it was very hard work for the team as we were based in three different pit garages and on consecutive races. IF we do enter next year it will probably be a three car team in just one grid.

 

I know this reduces the amount of spectator time value but three TR's haven't crossed the finish line at Le Mans since 1961 and so should still be something to savour.

 

hogie.

[hpremote]

Hogie: just tried to message you. I think your in-box may be full...

Cheers,

Tim.

[kevin bryant]

Alec,

 

Whilst I agree with much of what you have written, the general marketing guide for sponsorship is spend on activation what you spend on sponsorship. Following this guide would mean a direct sponsorship of £5k would probably justify an additional £5k in activation rather than £15k. That said each case should be taken on its own merits. So perhaps better to indicate some sort of a range for the activation and not scare everyone off right at the start.

 

 

The bit that I don't really accept is the "It's already too late". If the planning should have been done in the first 12 months after the last event and so effectively done and dusted in 12 months, why with the right mind-set and commitment couldn't the club achieve something similar in the current 12 months?

 

 

Personally, I'd like the club to take a proper look at this and see what could be done. If that doesn't meet the needs of the "past, current and present", then so be it but let's not rule it out before we've taken a proper look.

 

 

Take care Kev

 

[McMuttley]

mmmmm, when I was racing as my indulgent hobby, I paid my way and also paid the 'pit' crew too - bugger, I had it wrong all along

[Paul Hogan]

Further to Kevin's post above, Entries don't even open until September/ October so there is very little point in getting all your ducks lined up in a row before you know you can compete but based upon actual previous experience of the CLM organisation now is the right sort of time to have a discussion about entering and how to go about it.

 

Personally, I would love the Register to be involved but this is NOT about me or anyone else having a jolly on the Registers expense. It always struck me as rather odd that the TRR wanted to capitalise on our efforts in the past by selling T shirts etc to swell its own coffers but wouldn't lend its support to the team. But in fairness that was under a previous ctte who didn't like racing.

 

Moreover, the fact that Wayne Scott's video blogs is now registering in excess of 10,000 hits and is still scoring shows there must be some interest in what we try to do. I would just like the club to recognise that fact and use us for promotional purposes but its a two way street.

 

Hogie.

[rhino_mac]

I'm hoping to take my TR3 to Le Mans Classic next year to watch for the first time. I'm having a chat over burger and chips this week with a friend to organise it all.

 

I'd certainly like to see some TR's there - it would certainly give me more impetus to get myself sorted and over there this time (we missed last year).

 

Good luck finding sponsorship!

[john.r.davies]

As you may know, despite the anniversarial significance, Jigsaw could not obtain places to recreate the three Spitfire team at the last CLM. So a three car team in one "plateau" seems unlikely.

 

If the TR team has sufficient people to staff it's pit crew AND sufficient cash to fund the entries, fine, but given the relative lack of interest from the Register membership or administration, financial support from the club should not be more than a token. Motorsport has no right to "public" support. It should stand on its own feet and those of its supporters.

[Paul Hogan]

As you may know, despite the anniversarial significance, Jigsaw could not obtain places to recreate the three Spitfire team at the last CLM. So a three car team in one "plateau" seems unlikely.

 

If the TR team has sufficient people to staff it's pit crew AND sufficient cash to fund the entries, fine, but given the relative lack of interest from the Register membership or administration, financial support from the club should not be more than a token. Motorsport has no right to "public" support. It should stand on its own feet and those of its supporters.

Hi John,

 

Yes, I felt really sorry for Mark and Jo Field at CLM last year. I thought their team of Spitfires looked great and should have raced but sadly its down to the race organisers but also how the entry is put together. I don't know what steps Jigsaw took but having been granted three entries there before, I'm obviously doing something right. But like those men in advertising say, I just wish I knew what it was that worked!

 

Hogie.

[Alec Pringle]

Hi Kevin,

 

"the general marketing guide for sponsorship is spend on activation what you spend on sponsorship"

 

That hasn't changed in the past 40 years then !

 

I still regard 50/50 activation/sponsorship as offering little more than an indulgence for the directors, and I'd suggest that a sponsor looking to maximise return to shareholders ought to be looking at more like 75/25 or even the proverbial 80/20 - if a sponsorship exercise is going to translate into a really useful marketing and sales campaign, that is.

 

The way I see it, for a 2016 CLM team the Register ought by now to have a solid proposal on the table for consideration by the organisers, not just the team composition in terms of cars and drivers, but also the detail of projected member support in terms of attending spectators, and the detail of the club's marketing and PR campaign - together with the bottom line benefits accruing to the ACO and Peter organisation.

 

Bums on seats and euros in the till . . . . . that's what counts. The big players have already laid their cards on the table and made their bids, in conjunction with the appropriate media outlets - and by now the also rans should have their more modest proposals en route and be lobbying hard. If we haven't achieved that already, it's a bit late to be concerning ourselves with the stable doors.

 

Better to focus on 2018 . . . . .

 

Cheers

 

Alec

[kevin bryant]

"

Better to focus on 2018 . . . . ."

 

Well I'd be 60 then with the option of retirement. Now could I afford to decamp to France for a couple of months picking up Le Mans on the way down and Classic Le Mans on the way back?

 

Perhaps I ought to focus on building a stock of those brownie points. They just seem harder and harder to acquire these days. Tips anyone?

 

Kev

[Alec Pringle]

Hi Kevin,

 

I thought you'd accumulated an awful lot of brownie points for all your fine efforts at Combe and Blyton !

 

Recently I was chatting to an acquaintance whose establishment specialises in the preparation of some of the more exotic varieties of Le Mans Classic entries. These guys are equipped with 7-figure budgets, and since last year's Classic have already expended a 6-figure sum in terms of preparing presentations to organisers, their sponsors, and media. Grafting steadily since the return from last year's event.

 

That's the kind of effort and expenditure that is evidently appropriate at the front of the grids.

 

OK, it's not the same financial implication for the midfield and tail end runners, but I would suggest that similar principles apply when it comes to the groundwork . . . . .

 

Meanwhile, Le Mans Classic isn't the only major event on the calendar, not by a long chalk, and there would seem to be ample scope for the TR Register to evolve a much more significant profile in terms of supporting TR entrants in the major classic races throughout Europe. That does not necessarily imply spending loadsamoney on direct sponsorship, but it most certainly does imply a longer term strategy with a very considerable input of effort to support the marque TR in competition.

 

The appointment of a Competition Director might be a jolly good starting point . . . . .

 

Cheers

 

Alec

[ianc]

The Board decided recently that the club could not afford to maintain the TR7 Coke car and disposed of it rather rapidly. Yet it was clearly a marketing/publicity tool for the club, especially in the eyes of folk who might not be able to afford the ‘traditional’ TR (i.e. those with a chassis), and it demonstrated that the TR Register caters for ALL TRs.

 

So how could the club afford to sponsor a team of TRs for Le Mans, an event that, as Alec has so clearly described, just eats money – and for what value to the club?

 

Ian Cornish

[john.r.davies]

If the Club cannot/will not/should not support TRs at the CLM, then who will?

The drivers/owners obviously must bear the largest burden as they will get most satisfaction, but it's a lot to pay for a weekend's fun, and others are involved.

Which returns to asking pit crew to pay to take part.

 

My outline above did not cater for a 'mob-handed' approach or a jolly, but to a strictly selected and rostered team of four for each section. This need not exclude the driver/owner's usual friends and family.

Each of the 'sessions' would cost them about the same as an ordinary race entry, with the added benefit of being involved in an event with more prestige than a dozen club races in the UK.

Alec objected, pointing out travel and living expenses, which will be incurred if you merely attend and spectate, so should not be included in the analysis. He also said that pit crew see little of the racing, and are they to work, not play - that is my point! They are paying for the privilege and satisfaction of being far more closely involved in the event than someone sitting in the stands. I know - I've been in both positions!

 

Finally, Alec says that it is ridiculous to ask pit crew to pay for that privilege. I don't agree, if it will get and keep TRs in the CLM.

And I will be completely open - I would pay to do that.

 

John

[Paul Hogan]

Had an interesting 'phone call yesterday with regard to our Penrite sponsorship of last year . Although there is new management there, sales of Penrite oil to TRR members has been significantly encouraging and so rather than having the door slammed in our face it has been left open. So can I encourage you all to buy some more Penrite oil please?

 

Hogie.

[roy53]

Looks like John burns most of it.So that should help.

 

Roy

[hpremote]

Yep, John, I'd pay to join the Pit crew too; after all, I'm going to CLM anyway. It's a fabulous long weekend for petrolheads who love old machinery, with a great vibe from other attenders and a terrific selection of motors at the campsites dotted around the track.

The atmosphere in the pits and in the garages is certainly involving and exciting.

 

I am firmly of the opinion that racing TRs at CLM does a great deal of good for the marque - and if we were to get just a little bit of help from the Register towards running/entering the cars, the publicity accruing therefrom will be worth it in spades.

 

Tim.

[Alec Pringle]

Hi Ian,

 

the blessed Coke car was, as I understood it at the time, originally acquired as a short term project only. It ran on to become a long term project, perhaps more by default than intent, but evidently without enjoying the sort of maintenance regime necessary to keep a classic car in prime condition. So what was a worthwhile exercise was allowed to become a potential embarrassment and/or liability simply by virtue of inadequate management..

 

So presumably this year it was going to cost serious money to put to rights, and the board decided that wasn't cost-effective expenditure.

 

Reasonable enough, and not quite a case of " the club could not afford to maintain the TR7 Coke car " . . . . . more a case of choosing to view club expenditure with due prudence.

 

As for sponsorship " and for what value to the club? ", then I'd suggest that the value to the club of TR motor sport sponsorship could and should be significant, and fundamental.

 

The old Triumph company earned something of a sporting reputation in the 1930s. Sir John Black revived that reputation in the 1950s, and it carried through to the end of TR production.

 

Today, and in the future, TR ownership is an alternative to a more modern sports car at a fraction of the price. Competition made the breed, and an ongoing competitive profile is one of the elements that will continue " to preserve the marque TR ". That is, after all, our raison d'etre . . . . .

 

If the TR ceases to be regarded as a competitive and therefore desirable machine, it's unlikely that there will be a continuing supply of potential owners wiling to pay five times the price of an equivalent, more modern classic - BMW, Honda, Mazda, MG, Toyota, or whatever. Active TR competitors are a small minority, always have been and always will be. But they fly the flag - and the reflected glory rubs off across the marque and the club alike . . . . .

 

I'd suggest that we owe it to ourselves to extend a degree of general support to the TR competitors.

 

Cheers

 

Alec

[Andrew Smith]

Hello folks.

 

I know next years CLM is a long way off but I have been asked if I could put a 3 car TR team together with a view to competing there again. ...............

 

 

What three cars are you talking about Paul?

 

Cheers

Andrew

Edited August 2, 2015 by Andrew Smith

[Paul Hogan]

Hi Andrew, I'm not at liberty to say just now but at the moment its unlikely to be TRS styled although I am keeping the door open. IF I could ever get the support from the CLM organisers then I would love to enter a full field of cars and I'm not excluding overseas entries either. I'm going to be talking to Patrick Peter and as soon as I know what he will allow I will of course let out TR community know. Meanwhile, I think Alec is quite right, TR's enjoyed an excellent competition history in period at both racing and rallying and I think its incumbent that we try and continue this proud tradition. If you think about what racing has done for Healeys, E-types and even A35's in raising not only their own profile but the financial value of the marques as a whole then everyone who owns a TR will reap a reward when the time comes to sell it on.

 

Many years ago I thoroughly enjoyed the spectacle of John Welburn's tank tape special and the other team members thrashing the Aston Martin team at the Donnington 6 hrs relay race. TR's were so good the teams handicap was increased for the following year and I think we still beat em. ( Alec will know the full story as he was team manager at the time). Since then Astons have gone stratospheric and E-types are not far behind. Healey's too are way ahead of TR values but are they better cars? Not really - at least not in my book and I've experienced all of them.

 

Hogie.

[john.r.davies]

Paul,

I have a PM for you, but you "are not receiving messages".

Please PM me, or else email - my address is in my profile.

Thank you,

John

[Alec Pringle]

The exploits of the TR Register teams in the 1980s relay races was the stuff of legend, and certainly played a part in raising the profile of the TR and the TR Register.

 

The last time I managed a team was a JDC Donington 4 Hours, late 80s, the 4 cylinder cars coming in 4th on straight distance, behind the leading Le Mans prototypes, which were followed home by the Can Am sports racers, Sports 2000, TR 4-pots, then the other S2000 team. We beat ALL the other production-based teams . . . . . Aston Martin, Austin Healey,BMW, Jaguar, Morgan, Porsche, etc etc - and the 6-pot TRs were only a couple or three places behind us. Sadly we were so heavily handicapped that we were several places down in the handicap placings !

 

The relay race results weren't just down to the drivers - we had an excellent pit and paddock crew at all the relay events, and great support from TR spectators too, many of whom were helping as 'spotters' out on the circuit, feeding back information by CB radio and even by arm and flag signals and runners. Nothing motivates the race drivers like the clusters of TRs parked around the circuit, and the TR guys and gals waving encouragement from the trackside.

 

As I've said before, we need to get back to where we once belonged.

 

But serious challenges require serious planning, which is where I have reservations about next year's CLM and the available timescale.

 

Cheers

 

Alec