RogerH Posted May 9, 2015 Report Share Posted May 9, 2015 Nick, Don't panic With the felt seal having apprx right thickness this should not put the disc in the wrong place. It may be that the PO did what he did because of another problem. You say the disc is now touching the caliper - this can happen when things get changed. Does the caliper need to go inwards (towards the centre of the car) - if so maybe a washer under the attachment face where the bolts go through will sort this. If the caliper needs to go outwards (away from the centre of the car) then that is more of a problem - you may have to remove metal from the caliper/attachment. Are/is the bearing fitted fully into its seat. If you remove the felt seal does it fit properly then Are you tightening the main stub axle nut up tight enough. Roger Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Revolution Posted May 9, 2015 Author Report Share Posted May 9, 2015 Hi Roger Removed the hub and bearings......again......and removed the felt oil seal. Refitted without the felt seal and it all fits like a glove.....wheel turns smoothly....just a little friction on the brake pads but nothing unusual The disc sits exactly in the centre of the caliper Just seems to be that few mm's of the felt and its retainer that's causing the problem Anything else I could use instead of the felt? How catastrophic would it be to run the car without a felt seal..........unknown to me, I've run the car for 5 years without one already Nick Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Jersey Royal Posted May 9, 2015 Report Share Posted May 9, 2015 Hi Roger Removed the hub and bearings......again......and removed the felt oil seal. Refitted without the felt seal and it all fits like a glove.....wheel turns smoothly....just a little friction on the brake pads but nothing unusual The disc sits exactly in the centre of the caliper Just seems to be that few mm's of the felt and its retainer that's causing the problem Anything else I could use instead of the felt? How catastrophic would it be to run the car without a felt seal..........unknown to me, I've run the car for 5 years without one already Nick Did you make sure you fitted the oil seal correctly, in that the metal part of it should be drifted into its groove or seating in the hub. Guy Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Graze Posted May 9, 2015 Report Share Posted May 9, 2015 I'm now losing my long lasting affection for this car and if I had the strength, it too would be nestling at the bottom of the garden!!! Any advice welcomed? Cheers, Nick Nick Don't toss the car, the frustration is proportional to the sheer enjoyment they give you You'll get it right and then enjoy your summer Graze Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RogerH Posted May 10, 2015 Report Share Posted May 10, 2015 Hi Nick, some sort of seal must be there. Otherwise grease could migrate onto the disc. If it all fits OK without the felt seal, then the seal is still too thick. Have a look at what Guy has posted. Have a look at the dimension that Grahamgl has posted. Is the bearing fully seated. Is there any muck/swarf under the bearing holding the bearing out the odd mm. How tight are loading the hub nut with the seal in place. If it is really tight and solid could the felt seal carrier (steel cup) be clamped between bearing and VL face Roger Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Revolution Posted May 10, 2015 Author Report Share Posted May 10, 2015 Thanks Roger Just wondering as per Guy's comments whether the seal carrier (steel cup) is seated far enough in to its seating..........should it sit in to the depth of the metal carrier as mine is bearly sat in the groove? Maybe, the bearing needs drifting in further to allow the carrier to be seated further in ? Nick Quote Link to post Share on other sites
peejay4A Posted May 10, 2015 Report Share Posted May 10, 2015 As mentioned earlier in the thread the inner race of the bearing should be drifted in as far as it will go, up against a shoulder in the hub. If it isn't that's the problem. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Steve Priest Posted May 10, 2015 Report Share Posted May 10, 2015 (edited) Perhaps try these? They look like NOS, so may fit without any trimming required. http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Pair-of-front-hub-oil-seals-Triumph-TR2-TR3-TR4-Payen-NA980-L102-also-Herald-/221733702613 However from what you say, it does sound like it may be something other than just the thickness felt causing the problem. Steve Edited May 10, 2015 by Steve Priest Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RogerH Posted May 10, 2015 Report Share Posted May 10, 2015 It would be interesting to see these and measure them just to compare to what is being offered in the kits. Roger Quote Link to post Share on other sites
stuart Posted May 10, 2015 Report Share Posted May 10, 2015 It would be interesting to see these and measure them just to compare to what is being offered in the kits. Roger Roger will let you know when they land Stuart. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Revolution Posted May 11, 2015 Author Report Share Posted May 11, 2015 Hi Everyone Took the hubs to the garage who fitted the new bearings for me and they confirmed bearings in place correctly and had been drifted down to their shoulders Definately no room for the Oil seal retainers to be drifted into a groove I'm away for a few days so will reassemble and drive "feltless" on my return to a mechanic in Aylesbury who services a few of the Chiltern Group TRs to get his view Bearing in mind (no pun intended) the PO had not fitted felt seals anyway, I'm wondering if I have non TR hubs fitted Photo attached Cheers, Nick Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RogerH Posted May 11, 2015 Report Share Posted May 11, 2015 Hi nick, your picture shows the metal retainer outwards. I may be wrong but I thought the felt should be outermost - rubbing against the VL. And the top edge of the retainer flush with the edge of the bearing recess on the hub. Roger Quote Link to post Share on other sites
graeme Posted May 11, 2015 Report Share Posted May 11, 2015 (edited) Hi Nick, Definately something amiss there. Is that the bearing outer race or as Roger says the felt is installed the wrong way. Cheers Graeme Edited May 13, 2015 by graeme Quote Link to post Share on other sites
peejay4A Posted May 11, 2015 Report Share Posted May 11, 2015 Agreed, that picture has the seal the wrong way round. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Lebro Posted May 11, 2015 Report Share Posted May 11, 2015 Also agree Bob Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Revolution Posted May 11, 2015 Author Report Share Posted May 11, 2015 Guys In the picture the felt and its retainer are not fitted....that is the bearing pressed in down to its shoulder.......and that 's how they looked with the old bearings in place when I first took the hubs off to replace with new bearings Also, no felts were fitted when i took the hubs off That's my problem....no room for the metal retainer and felt I reckon non standard hubs Nick Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Jersey Royal Posted May 11, 2015 Report Share Posted May 11, 2015 (edited) sorry double post Edited May 11, 2015 by Jersey Royal Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Jersey Royal Posted May 11, 2015 Report Share Posted May 11, 2015 Nick If thats how the hubs looked after you removed them, just take out that seal(backing metal of it), and replace with new turned the opposite way. Hmmm Guy Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Steve Priest Posted May 11, 2015 Report Share Posted May 11, 2015 (edited) Hi Nick, I wish I'd taken some pictures of my hubs after I removed them over the winter as the previous owner had made exactly the same mistake. The metal cup part of the seal had been inserted upside down (exactly as yours appear to be in the photo). The felt was then squished between the back of the cup and the vertical link. The picture in this post shows the seals inserted correctly although not tapped home. When they are, the top of the cup should be flush with the hub. http://www.britishcarforum.com/bcf/showthread.php?100608-59-TR3A-Front-Hub-Oil-Seal As Guy says, you should be able to carefully remove the seal cups and insert new seals the correct way round. Cheers, Steve Edited May 11, 2015 by Steve Priest Quote Link to post Share on other sites
graeme Posted May 11, 2015 Report Share Posted May 11, 2015 (edited) Graeme Edited May 13, 2015 by graeme Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Jersey Royal Posted May 12, 2015 Report Share Posted May 12, 2015 As I said im my previous post, the bearing is NOT installed correctly. The outer race should be installed first in the hub, then the inner race with the rollers is a loose fit in the outer race. This is what the outer race of the inner bearing should look like when installed in the hub. Graeme Graeme It does look to me that the bearing race in your photo,does need to be drifted into final position. Unless its an illusion on the photo Cheers Guy Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RogerH Posted May 12, 2015 Report Share Posted May 12, 2015 Hi Nick, to follow on from the posts above - remove the piece of metal immediately below your straight edge. This will expose your bearing. Can the centre of the bearing be simply lifted out - if yes, then it is fitted correctly. If no then the whole bearing needs removing and reinserting the other way round. The outer race goes in first. The inner race simply falls into place. The felt seal is fitted such that the felt is completely visible when you look towards the bearing. The felt rubs on the VL face. Roger Quote Link to post Share on other sites
peejay4A Posted May 12, 2015 Report Share Posted May 12, 2015 The outer race in Graeme's picture looks (to me) different to the OP's. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
foster461 Posted May 12, 2015 Report Share Posted May 12, 2015 Guys In the picture the felt and its retainer are not fitted....that is the bearing pressed in down to its shoulder.......and that 's how they looked with the old bearings in place when I first took the hubs off to replace with new bearings Also, no felts were fitted when i took the hubs off That's my problem....no room for the metal retainer and felt I reckon non standard hubs Nick I disagree Nick. What we are looking at in your picture is the back of the felt retainer. You can see it is dished. The bearing below it may or may not be installed correctly, there is too much grease to tell for sure but I would at least pull that seal out, check that the bearing is installed correctly and re-install the seal the correct way around. Stan Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Revolution Posted May 12, 2015 Author Report Share Posted May 12, 2015 Hello Everyone ! Well, after a few days of arguing, I'm now back in love with my TR ! The hubs are sorted and the felt seals are fitted and I've been out for a drive this evening.....all is well! I do feel so stupid though not to realise what was going on and a real numpty ! Basically the PO had fitted the bearings ok but had included the metal felt retainer and fitted it back to front .......without any felt The garage who fitted the new bearings for me did so "like for like" and repeated the error with the metal felt retainers ! As per Roger, I lifted out the retainers and fitted new seals the correct way round (see photo) Having totally abused the felt s which came with the wheel bearing kit (horrible yellow, fluffy things), I bought two new ones from TR Shop............these are slimmer, more substantial and didn't need any trimming Everything went back together effortlessly In closing, I must say a BIG, BIG thank you to everyone who has taken the trouble to help me.......your advice has been invaluable Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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