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Hello folks

Could someone tell me what I have done wrong here, os rear wheel at a "Triumph Herald" angle?

Will try to add a picture, don't hold your breath.

 

Second question refitting new floors and sills both sides, floors seem straight forward enough, just bolt em down leaving a little play to bash them about with. the sills though are a different matter. Trial fitted them with self tappers, pressed indents match up with the door edges and all looks OK from the top. The bottom edges though are a very different story, I assume (cos it's the only thing that makes sense) that the bottom edge of the outer sill should be level with the vertical face of the floor panel so I can plug weld one to togther, the only way I can achieve this is by jacking up the outer sill, this plays havoc with fitting the sill end caps which are quite a crude fit to start with.

Only planing to hold the lot together with self tappers 'till I have temporarly re hung front and rear wings to try and achieve good door / panel fit.

 

It feels good putting stuff back on rather than taking it off.

 

Please be gentle with me I'm not an engineer.

post-12561-0-99807300-1408550653_thumb.jpg

post-12561-0-80761000-1408550765_thumb.jpg

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I wouldn't worry too much about the rear wheel camber until it has the full weight of the body and fuel tank on it. Mine looked a bit like that. You'll have to set the rear camber and toe in after assembly anyway.

Edited by peejay4A
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The sill end fillers should have the flush face pointing inwards,

the lips point towards the wheel.

Try them 'tother way round.

 

It's the line-up of the outer sills that are most important.

The end fillers can be adjusted (with a hammer!) to fit the hole.

 

AlanR

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Thanks Pete, I was sort of hoping that was the case, but you know what it is when "other people" poke their nose on your shed,"oh why is that one at a funny angle" they say, It's nice to have an answer.

Thanks Alan I looked at both options, and the side I had not cut off had the flush face facing out, but thinking about it not sure how I would get a good weld that way round,

I have a good selection of hammers to bash stuff with but it may come down to liberal use of seam sealer.

Still not sure though how much I can force the outer sills up to meet the floor return panels.

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Hi Dave,

as Alan says turn the fillers around - flush side inside.

 

Remember that the inner (top) sill is not flush with the floor - it forms a dog leg. The filler should have the same joggle/dog leg.

 

The flange on the floor pan should be about the correct dimension so get the bottom of the sill to match with that. Then worry about the fillers.

 

Roger

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You got repro end caps and they are probably a bit too big.

A tiny amount too big will have a big effect on the sill.

 

Just do the sills and make the caps fit by turning over a bit more flange.

 

The floor pans have drain holes in them.

The sill covers a bit of these holes on mine, but not all or even most of it.

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OK thanks all,

Will go back to it tomorrow, I'm sure it will come right in the end, I got jacks, lots of hammers and lots of time. will leave the end caps 'till last and screw everything up and line everything up before I get stuck in to blowing holes in the new panels.

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My method of joining such panels is to punch pairs of holes. 1/4dia, so as to make short slots.

 

I drag the weld along the slot picking up the panel behind.

 

I have a hand tool for this so its quick.

 

This keep the flange tight to the main panel rather than having a V if you weld on the edge.

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From memory, (don't have pics) the end caps I got from Moss were a different shape to the space they had to fit into, at the end of the sills, so I had to cut, bend, and fettle to fit.

My sills were a bit thin in spots (rust) and the end result was more weld, shaped with an angle grinder, than original Triumph metal. Blurry photo of work in progress.

sill.jpg

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Inner sill to floor looks like this.

TonysTR6150.jpg

 

End caps fit like this

MarksTR5245.jpg

 

And this.

MarksTR5270.jpg

 

Ready for outer sill.

MarksTR5229_zpsf5bde768.jpg

 

Sill fitting.

MarksTR5265_zps8082dc96.jpg

 

Stuart.

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With the current outer sills you do need to weld them on at the top first and then jack the bottom edge up into place with a long piece of wood and then Mole grip it all the way along.The new end caps from Moss are so much better fitting as they are a proper pressing, the rest are rubbish.

You would be much better off buying yourself a spot welder to do this job, its much easier and neater.

Stuart.

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Not that I know anything about it but I have found that the critical thing with outer sills is to make sure the wings line up before you weld anything. More important on a 6 because of the stainless strips. Just look at how many sixes don't have those strips. Apologies if this is in the grandmothers and eggs category. JJC

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Thank you all for your help with this, absolutly brilliant. Looks to me like many roads lead to Rome, which is good as they all seem to get there.

I think Stuart is right about the end caps, I have the "other" sort, may be better to put them in the scrap bin and get another set from Moss, Not so sure I could justify buying a spot welder..............in enough trouble as it is, so will have a go at plug welding, I have watched bits on You Tube and if I can get half as good a finish I will be very happy, lots of practice first I think, and no playing with the welder 'till it's all lined up with the doors and wings, (where on earth did we get these terms from, Wings, bonnet, boot, don't get me wrong I'm no fan of Hood, fenders and trunk either, just curious)

Thanks again all and thanks Stuart for the photos,

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Thanks for the tip Alan will try that later, I have also heard of clamping a lump off copper behind the weld area to act as a heat sink might save blowing holes through the new panels so will give it a go. Lowered the rear half of the body back on today, so I have something to hang the rear wings on to. lowered fine nothing fits though, could be a day or two shoving things around 'till they look right.

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On my rebuild I've got my inner sills flush with the vertical flange on the floor. Looking at Stuarts pics and Rogers post, it seems that I shouldn't have!! I haven't welded them to the floors yet though, so seems like I should move them inboard a bit - but then they get very close to the washers on the floor mountings??

 

Also, a mistake I have made is welding the inner and outer sills together along the top edge before fitting them - that is now causing problems trying to get the doors and wings to fit nicely with the outer sill and not being able to move it independently from the inner. I'm thinking of seperating them - any views?

 

David C - just so you don't feel alone, I too have wonky rear wheels just like yours - a problem for another day!!

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Hi Stuart,

 

I've yet to cut my floors out, and I thought I'd be rewelding floors into position before fitting inner sills. I see you've welded the inner sill in position on the floor before fitting the floor, how did you establish the inner sill position on the floor front to back? is it just line up the panels end to end and how did you establish the position of the sill on the floor across the car ? Is it close enough to line up the vertical faces of floor and inner sill before welding ?

 

Mick Richards

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Inner sill to floor looks like this.

 

 

End caps fit like this

 

 

And this.

 

 

Ready for outer sill.

 

 

 

 

 

Stuart.

Ye gods. So that's how you meant to do it.

Thank Xst it's down the bottom (on mine) where you can't really see it, and thank the same bloke that you can't see both sides at once.

RIMG0111-3.jpg

 

(PS. anyone having Photobucket upload problems?)

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On my rebuild I've got my inner sills flush with the vertical flange on the floor. Looking at Stuarts pics and Rogers post, it seems that I shouldn't have!! I haven't welded them to the floors yet though, so seems like I should move them inboard a bit - but then they get very close to the washers on the floor mountings??

 

Also, a mistake I have made is welding the inner and outer sills together along the top edge before fitting them - that is now causing problems trying to get the doors and wings to fit nicely with the outer sill and not being able to move it independently from the inner. I'm thinking of seperating them - any views?

 

David C - just so you don't feel alone, I too have wonky rear wheels just like yours - a problem for another day!!

The inner sill is slightly in board of the drop section of the floor, if you look at the end caps you can see that they step over at each end and yes the inner edge of the inner sill is very close if not touching the floor mounting washers..You dont really want the inner and outer welded together until you have everything lining up including a trial fit of the outer wings. Depending on how you have welded them together you may struggle to separate them now.

Stuart.

Edited by stuart
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Hi Stuart,

 

I've yet to cut my floors out, and I thought I'd be rewelding floors into position before fitting inner sills. I see you've welded the inner sill in position on the floor before fitting the floor, how did you establish the inner sill position on the floor front to back? is it just line up the panels end to end and how did you establish the position of the sill on the floor across the car ? Is it close enough to line up the vertical faces of floor and inner sill before welding ?

 

Mick Richards

Mick if you look at my pictures you can see that the inner sill lower edge is slightly inside the lower drop section of the floor and the end caps have a corresponding step in them as well. You can only weld the inner sill to the floor if you have the shell cut in half and all the lower edges of the front and back halves repaired so then you can fit the floors to the chassis and then slide the front and back halves around to get the best door gaps. Outer sills can then be fitted last.

If you arent then take the old floor out and inner sill and best part of outer sill leaving the top flat section of the outer sill in place to maintain the door gap then loose fit the inner sill and then the floor and line them up using the moulded depressions then weld them in and fit the outer sill after. Everything will line up if the bottom of the "A" and "B" posts are good and toe board lips are present.If not then they will need repairing while its all out.Bit simplified but if you take loads of measurements and photos before you start then its not too difficult.

I still recommend anyone contemplating doing this buy yourself a spot welder and learn how to use it. It makes the job much quicker and neater and will look like factory. If your plug welding you have much more work in all the grinding required to clean it all up after.

Stuart.

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Thanks Stuart - that was the answer I was expecting...... I've removed the drivers sill this morning and managed to separate the 2 halves without causing too much damage. I can now fit the inner sill correctly, then carry on with the door alignmnet, wing fit etc before fitting the outer sill in place last of all. thanks for your help.

Jeff

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Thanks for clarifying the copper behind trick, all makes sence now. will continue to hang loose body panels back in place and shove things around 'till it looks "right". A little concerned that the rear half of the body tub actually sits on top of the rear suspension top crossmember, I think it may take 3 or 4 of the ally shims on the rear chassis mounting to lift it clear! hope I haven't got droopy chassis syndrome as well as poor penetration and copper behind!

Wish I had read Stuarts comments before I started weilding the angle grinder.

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Hi Stuart,

you need to let Albert loose in the garage for a while. In oyur 5th pic you appear to have a very bad case of 'moles'

 

Hi JDP,

back in the 90's when rebuilding my 4A I too had flush inner sill and floor pan flange. I was so proud of my effort, everything looked good.

The next day I looked at the end filler cap and nearly burst out in tears.

It took another two days to recover the situation.

 

Why did ST put that joggle in there ?

 

Roger

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