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Breadvan TR2 (or 3?)


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Hi, my first forum post! Ex (sadly) TR2 and GTR4 Dove owner. Anyway, many years ago I encountered a special bodied TR 2 or possibly 3 in a London side street and wondered if any one else has any knowledge of it. Otherwise of a standard shape, it sported a very well-executed breadvan style roof coming back horizontally from the top of what appeared to be a regular 'screen and ending in a vertical Kamm theory tail into which was let a rectangular rear window. The whole car was in primer, and was clearly inspired by the Drogo bodied Ferrari Breadvan built in 1962. Any info greatfully received. Thanks, Geoff Holden.

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Hi Geoff,

 

grey primer perchance ?

 

There was a TR3(A?) lived in Market Harborough fitting that description, and it's the only one I've ever seen or heard of. I looked at it en route to the Birkett one year it was at Donington, 1978 0r 79. Finished in a delicate shade of grey primer, awaiting respray. A well executed conversion, the rear window made me think Austin A40 Farina. It had been off the road for some little while at the time, I never did get to meet the owner, a neighbour of a pal of mine in Market Harborough. Story was that the conversion dated back to the early 1960s, and it gave that impression - certainly wasn't a recent conversion at the time.

 

Cheers,

 

Alec

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Yup, grey primer; sounds like the one Alec! Thanks for the swift response and good memory. Timing ties in too, as it was some time during the '70's that I saw it. Wonder if it's still with us? Hope it's not brown bread.

 

Anyone seen it of late? G.

 

Btw, like the Anglia John. I ran an Anglia/Cortina/Lotus bitsa rally car for a while, but it didn't look anything like that (not at first anyway).

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Hi Geoff,

 

haven't seen it since then. My chum Dave moved to Norfolk 3 or 4 years later, and if I recall correctly the owner of the breadvan had sold it someone who was going to revert it to original. Great pity, it was a good looking special and looked pukka factory rather than home-brewed, although my understanding at the time was that it was someone's one-off project, nothing to do with factory prototypes or anything of that sort.

 

Cheers,

 

Alec

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Anyway, many years ago I encountered a special bodied TR 2 or possibly 3 in a London side street and wondered if any one else has any knowledge of it. Otherwise of a standard shape, it sported a very well-executed breadvan style roof coming back horizontally from the top of what appeared to be a regular 'screen and ending in a vertical Kamm theory tail into which was let a rectangular rear window.

 

Sounds like a TR3 with fastback hardtop that I looked at with

a view to buying in about 1971. It was maroon at the time and

lived in north London. A girling disc brake 3, I think,

The hardtop was well executed and I was tempted but I didn't

buy.

Number then was WBJ 700 - maybe someone could do a check on the

official records - I don't have the site to hand.

 

AlanR

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Hi Geoff,

 

distant bells ringing, hadn't thought of that car for years, suddenly remembered some other comments I'd long forgotten so I went hunting in my archives . . . .

 

Yes I found some notes of a story I received a decade or so later, late 80s, from a chap who reckoned he knew the car in the 60s . . . . and as I've never heard of anything else resembling it, very probably the same car. That the car in question was a 3A, 1959 or 60, converted from new for a South London Standard Triumph dealer by one of the firms making estate car conversions at the time, either Abbotts of Farnham or Friary of Basingstoke. I think I'm right in saying that Friary converted big Vauxhalls, Abbotts big Fords. The inspiration wasn't Ferrari I'm afraid, more Austin/Farina, and the motivation was for better accommodating two small children, not high speed competition work.

 

I can't imagine an oddball 3A provided inspiration for Ferrari either !! I suppose it's just conceivable that there might have been some connection with or inspiration towards the Dove principle, or that might be entirely coincidental.

 

Cheers,

 

Alec

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Hi Geoff,

 

distant bells ringing, hadn't thought of that car for years, suddenly remembered some other comments I'd long forgotten so I went hunting in my archives . . . .

 

Yes I found some notes of a story I received a decade or so later, late 80s, from a chap who reckoned he knew the car in the 60s . . . . and as I've never heard of anything else resembling it, very probably the same car. That the car in question was a 3A, 1959 or 60, converted from new for a South London Standard Triumph dealer by one of the firms making estate car conversions at the time, either Abbotts of Farnham or Friary of Basingstoke. I think I'm right in saying that Friary converted big Vauxhalls, Abbotts big Fords. The inspiration wasn't Ferrari I'm afraid, more Austin/Farina, and the motivation was for better accommodating two small children, not high speed competition work.

 

I can't imagine an oddball 3A provided inspiration for Ferrari either !! I suppose it's just conceivable that there might have been some connection with or inspiration towards the Dove principle, or that might be entirely coincidental.

 

Cheers,

 

Alec

 

 

 

I remember seeing the dark red "estate" TR3 parked at Northampton railway station on a regular basis in the early/mid seventies.

 

John.

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Hi Alan,

 

posts crossed !

 

WBJ 700 doesn't come up on DVLA, at least not as a Triumph.

 

I have seen photos of a fastback TR3A in the past, top a bit like a Lenham Sprite, very possibly the car you refer to ? The car I'm referring to was more of an estate car than a fastback, GTE style. As Geoff mentioned, horizontal roof not fastback, and with a decent size rear window in the tailgate - although at first glance it didn't actually look like an opening tailgate. I think I'm right in recalling it as all-steel too, not fibreglass.

 

Cheers,

 

Alec

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I half-guessed that the breadvan may have gone the way of a lot of specials during the period when the interest in such one-offs became outweighed by the value of a well restored standard car. The same fate befell a lot of cars that I suspect in some cases, if they'd survived that period of their lives, would now perhaps even command a premium over the standard example. Early Rolls-Royce and Bentley woodies, XK estates etc spring to mind.

 

Anyway, thanks all for the input, guys. I'm greatly impressed by the power of the TR Forum to unearth as much information on such an obscure subject in such a short space of time. I'll be back! G.

 

ps: Like the Vitesse John; did that precede Volvo's Touring Car Series effort?

 

pps: Hens teeth time; did anyone get a pic of the TR breadvan??!!

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ps: Like the Vitesse John; did that precede Volvo's Touring Car Series effort?

 

 

No, raced 2003-7.

"Inspired by" perhaps!

I'm told that those racing Volvo estates DID have an aero advantage, but the Volvo marketing people told them that it was hard enough to sell Volvos on sporting exploits, and that the folk who wanted a Volvo estate were far more interested in green wellies and labradors than the BTCC, so they should concentrate on saloons!

 

I never got to the end of the experiment - full skirts and air dam/spoiler - as I was forever fiddiling woth the cooling. The rear radiator never worked properly on the track and it always overheated.

John

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No Peter, roof on the one I saw was horizontal back to a vertical rear panel, but thanks for posting the great pic. Never seen any pic of this car before; do either of those built survive?

 

Roger: I'm in Twickenham, so the Uxbridge show would be easy for me. I'll check out the date and earmark it if I'm free.

 

Regards, G.

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  • 2 weeks later...

As it hints: "Only two were built". So maybe the one Geoff has reffered to is the second of the tr3 coupe prototypes. Any more tr3 prototypes like this? Oh by the way, did triumph stanpart ever make a tr3 hardtop with a sun roof???

 

Cheers,

JDB

post-9021-0-65261000-1301269220_thumb.jpg

post-9021-0-65261000-1301269220_thumb.jpg

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Hi James,

 

the 'saloon' TR3 was a New Zealand built conversion to individual commission, not a prototype, and supposedly one of two. The TR Register of New Zealand could tell you more about it.

 

It has nothing to do with the car to which Geoff refers, nor with the car to which I refer - and in all probability Geoff and I are referring to the same car, which was almost certainly an individually commissioned conversion and nothing to do with Standard Triumph. It may possibly be that there were two not dissimilar 3A conversion in the UK, one courtesy of a coachbuilder as mentioned previously, the other built by a Standard Triumph employee. Or the two may be one and the same, as in a ST employee or dealer commissioning the car/s. The two differing accounts that I heard long ago were even then 20+ years after the event, and accounts can easily and innocently be misinterpreted over the years.

 

Cheers,

 

Alec

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Thanks for your response Alec,

 

Gosh, HOW DO YOU KNOW ALL THESE THINGS??? As I remember, The tr3 looked like a pre-gtr4. One of them was white and the other, I think was red. For, the breadvan, I have no idea.

 

Cheers,

JDB

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  • 1 year later...

Having some enforced time to kill I started to chase up my old TR's in New Zealand and contacted Kevin Tinkler the NZ TR Register a great and very helpful bloke. He sent me details of my TR6 which is the only TR I actually got to drive in NZ the other two TR2's still being projects when I sold them.

 

One of my old TR2's was a copy of the car above in fibreglass. When I owned it the coupe body had already been removed and destroyed.

 

Kevin also told me that the Origonal coupe is being restored and is alive and kicking in NZ. I have asked if I can post the Article written by him for the NZ register magazine so hopefully it will be attached as well as a copy of a photo of my old car.

 

The Photos and article remain the copyrighted property of the TR Register NZ and are reproduced with their permission.

 

TS3533

 

TS3533.jpg

 

Article in Pdf form at bottom of post ©New Zealand TR Register

 

 

 

Cheers

 

Alan

TS5512-O NZ TR2 Coupe.pdf

TS5512-O NZ TR2 Coupe.pdf

Edited by Kiwifrog
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Kevin in NZ is also a friend of mine and it seems that T R Taylor Limited, the S-T dealer in Dunedin, sold their own special version of the TR2 called the TR2S. Such vehicles were fitted with selected High Speed Equipment accessories and designed to appeal to wealthy local sheep farming families. Only a handful are believed to have been sold.

 

T R Taylor Limited also sold at least one of the genuine Speed Model TR2's shipped to NZ.

 

Viv.

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